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Launch HN: BlackOakTV (YC S21) – Netflix for black people

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Re: Launch HN: BlackOakTV (YC S21) – Netflix for black people

#841

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that because they are black though? Without asking those people why they watched something else you are just making the assumption it was to do with their skin colour and not anything to do with the content itself. e.g. I don't watch a lot of content with women on Youtube. Not because I have anything against women. It because the subjects I am interested in, isn't covered typically by women.

> Is that because they are black though? Bluntly, yes. A lot of people in the U.S. are implicitly or explicitly racist. You can see this in statistics, such as 'black-sounding' resumes consistently getting less callbacks than 'white-sounding' resumes [1]. [1]: http://www-2.rotman.utoronto.ca/facbios/file/Whitening%20MS%...

After skimming that report. They talks about "whitening" names. I know for a fact that a lot of my friends from Hong Kong would have a "English" name to make it easy for English people to pronounce their names.

Also the whole "whitening" (Whatever that means) of a CV/Resume sounds like something that is completely subjective.

Sorry but the different in applications could be again explained by something else e.g. simply being able to remember the name.

Racism is claimed for every disparity now between racial groups. While I doubt that it can a factor, I doubt it is the singular cause.

Also this says nothing about Youtube views.

Re: Launch HN: BlackOakTV (YC S21) – Netflix for black people

#842
post #427

Congrats on the launch, but you are attacking a difficult market, with a strong 'political' risk/factor as we can see in this thread. If I remember correctly there was a similar startup in YC S15 ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9903229 ) that shutdown 2 years after ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15292534 , https://techpoint.africa/2017/09/22/afrostream-shut-down/ ). In streaming content is king and ove…

Yes! We've talked with that founder, and he certainly let us know it's a hard business. I think the important thing for us to find an audience for the content we're starting with. We identified a niche within black audiences that we think is particularly underserved, and we're trying to meet their demand. If we can get them, it gets us to a pretty decent level, and with that MRR, we can move into another niche, and t…

I had an idea this morning for a referral mechanism to help with building an audience- what if you gave subscribers the ability to share a specific show with a friend for free? The friend would have access to that whole show (or maybe just a season) beyond the 7 day free trial and would presumably be coming back repeatedly to the site to watch it, giving them the opportunity to see other content they're interested in and subscribe.

As a subscriber it's easier and more fun to tell people about the site because you can get your friends watching the same fun show with you without the barrier of them having to subscribe up front.

I guess it would be hard to stop people from using a feature like this to watch whatever they want without having to subscribe - but maybe a subscriber would only get a limited number of 'shares' that refresh when the sharee converts. That way someone who's sharing multiple shows with the same friend would have a limit but someone whose shares are bringing in new subscribers would be equipped to invite more and more people.

Re: Launch HN: BlackOakTV (YC S21) – Netflix for black people

#843
Here are a few thoughts:

#1

Content saturation is a slow moving train and higher quality content just has a slower race to "free" than other content. To combat free, you need to control the content. Netflix had to aggressively reinvest into its own exclusive high quality content to avoid someone outcompeting them on the same content at a lower price (which the owners of the licensed content could do). The more effective they are at growth, the better control they have over maintaining the licensing advantage which allows them to stay relevant as a cultural hub.

There is so much high quality culturally important content now that almost nobody can afford to pay for it all, which makes cost a concerning gatekeeper for culture. Additionally, television's linear nature and technological inferiority meant it was doing a poor job of providing the kind of access to content that people were becoming used to.

Now there are several services providing access to large collections of free movies and TV shows, but there are still plenty of classics missing in their libraries which feels like leaving history behind. You aren't the only one that noticed the TV of yesteryear has become harder to find and it's far from being only black content.

Unfortunately for premium content the situation may be even worse, as the competition is causing fragmentation and I think this fragmentation has an outsized negative impact on already under-represented niches that become even more thinned out as a result. In this case the fragmentation is more problematic, because black households have lower average incomes, yet the higher fragmentation increases monetary pressures involved in accessing the content across paid services. Look up people's favorite old shows, then see which streaming services have them and there are splits between Netflix, Hulu, HBO, Sling, etc.

There's already a lot of black content, but user friendly discovery and access are very real problems. The licensing of some existing content below a threshold might also be less valuable for the smaller audiences when you're facing stiff competition. The upside of this is that companies can compete by funding new projects (which they are doing), but of course those new projects are then exclusive which doesn't help unless they're exclusive to the service that everyone's already subscribed to.

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#2

So with those things said, where does BlackOak fit in this picture? It doesn't have control over its underlying technical infrastructure since it's based on a middleware service. The free originals I've seen on the site so far are relatively low budget and while some of it is interesting, there is clearly inexperience around the areas of production, acting, scriptwriting, editing and so on.

There's more effort put into them than typical YouTube videos, but the entertainment value is not that dense yet and I'd put the perception of it as very inconsistent even drooping to awkward improv sketch quality. Simply being original content doesn't feel like enough when YouTube has so much original content that has less than 1000 views and BlackOak still exists as part of the internet which keeps it in competition with other content on the internet. There are definitely some actors in there that I'd be interested in watching more of if the whole thing was snapped together well, though.

I think if that quality trajectory is maintained, it would be difficult to keep viewers around through advertisement interruptions if you transition to free. The subscription cost is low, but my guess is if you hide the content behind a sizzle reel then people might pay for a month just to check it out and then not return.

If you can't invest more funding into those types of projects, perhaps you would be better off funding projects that already have lower budgets so you can increase the quality. When the content comes across as inauthentic in scenarios where the actors can't pull it off, then reality TV type approaches, interviews and other formats might have better success where people can play more loose. Unfortunately, unless you get really lucky, you're going to need some decent funding to hit a critical mass with whatever content you make or license and if you can't build that kind of confidence in investors then you may be better off pivoting to something you can create demand for.

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#3

Not a fan of the name, logo, domain, messaging, confrontational activist vibe or site design, but those aren't a big deal until you have content that draws in viewers unless potential future investors are also seeing it as their first impression of you.

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#4

Personally suspect blackness alone isn't enough for black audiences to dive into an upstart platform as the market isn't completely devoid of black content, I think it's just that there's a feeling of there not being enough of it in the public places that are deemed most visible which make some feel less culturally relevant. This same issue can apply to anyone, regardless of the characteristics they're measured by. YouTube's algorithmic sleight of hand can make people feel culturally relevant by drawing people to content that's relevant to their interests and letting you see a lot of other people engaged in it. Race is clearly not irrelevant and stronger racial culture can make it more relevant, but the relevance of it is probably greater in some contexts than others.

Netflix, Amazon, Hulu, Pluto, Sling, YouTube, Twitter, Facebook, advertising companies and so on are in a better position to address that I think. If you can maintain the funding to be relentless and create a critical mass of content then you might eventually be able to flip that prediction to become an observable public place. My guess is that African descent purchasing power will continue to increase over time around the globe and companies will find a way to capture those dollars as they always do. If you can navigate the insights to be one of those companies, then give it a go! There are a lot of classic shows with black actors that aren't on any streaming service anywhere, so opportunity does exist.

Re: Launch HN: BlackOakTV (YC S21) – Netflix for black people

#844

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW I don't gather that a lot of black people consume or respect BET how people may assume they do. Please read this reddit thread, it highlights so many opportunities: https://www.reddit.com/r/BlackPeopleTwitter/comments/aag6aj/... My summary of weak spots mentioned: - Not black-owned - Very heavy on commercials - Missing lots of quality content - Generally inauthentic - Not creating opportunities for HBCU students…

"Not black-owned" I have to admit, I would have more sympathy with their cause if they weren't so openly racist. I am in favour of freedom of opinion, though, so if they want "black owned" producers, they are certainly entitled to it.

To a community whose origin revolves around the value of their labor going entirely to violent oppressors, ownership structure of enterprises that claim to represent them is understandably prized.

Re: Launch HN: BlackOakTV (YC S21) – Netflix for black people

#846

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is a somewhat unique case because of (of course) slavery, and in particular how long it lasted and how difficult it was to eradicate the last vestiges of explicit or implicit slavery. (People were still being treated as de facto slaves into the 1960s, for example: https://www.livescience.com/61886-modern-slavery-united-stat... ) In most other countries, including other countries that practiced slavery, either…

There has to be more, because in Europe, and particularly in southern europe there has been slavery for thousends of years. Everyone has been slave to everyone, like a free for all. Yet there's no one making claims based on that, and I'm not aware that such claims existed in the past neither. People just accepted as a fact of life and moved on. If you look at how all the relations played out between southern europe,…

A lot of black people arrived in Europe comparatively recently, the last ~60 years or so, and often from a specific country rather than the vague concept of "my ancestors several hundred years ago came from somewhere in Africa, but who knows where exactly?"

Besides, not all forms of slavery are equal; what made American slavery fairly unique is that you were born in to it, was for life, based on skin colour, and was an important part of society/the economy.

While the general concept of slavery goes back to before history, this particular combination is actually fairly rare as far as I know. In modern Europe slavery was never part of society in the same way (i.e. you didn't have a slaves in England or Belgium, just the colonies), and in more ancient times slavery was a lot more "flexible" (detail differ greatly) compared to US slavery, in some cases being a temporary thing as punishment or crimes etc.

Re: Launch HN: BlackOakTV (YC S21) – Netflix for black people

#847

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These data show that only about one in eight white students (12.9%) attends a school where a majority of students are black, Hispanic, Asian, or American Indian. (We refer to this group collectively as students of color hereafter.) In contrast, nearly seven in 10 black children (69.2%) attend such schools (see Figure A). That seems less like segregation and more of just statistics. If black students are a minority,…

Keep going! How did there come to be schools that were predominantly black? Why is school funding tied to property taxes? Why isn't there a level of mobility that would allow students to go to a more well funded school? Who made these policies and why?

> How did there come to be schools that were predominantly black?

The residents in their area are mostly black.

> Why is school funding tied to property taxes?

That's how most of your city is funded.

> Why isn't there a level of mobility that would allow students to go to a more well funded school?

There is? Like, you can move to a different school district but it's going to be more expensive. Nobody is preventing you.

> Who made these policies and why?

It's not clear what policies you are referring to. That we fund things via property taxes?

Re: Launch HN: BlackOakTV (YC S21) – Netflix for black people

#848

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd say you have a fair point about the competition, but not about their being a lack of critical examination. A critical examination of the market would yield the fact that surveyed black viewers want more content targeted at them, don't feel fully represented even in the existing black content that's out there, and that despite an admittedly (and perhaps temporary) spike in black content, an estimated $10b in reven…

Maybe it's just because I have more exposure to the Hollywood side of this than you do, but you're very dismissive of BET and your other Hollywood competitors in a way that suggests you didn't do your research and that you're thinking that your tech backgrounds will magically let you jump into this market without actually knowing how it works. BET can never be all the way in on serving the black audience, as Viacom w…

Not scientific but observationally their target market does seem relatively high use on social media - so probably an opportunity if they picked up traction - low budget could also be authentic and black ownership for example is differentiating.

That said the attacks on the existing options read a bit weak - will be fun to see what they come up with!

Re: Launch HN: BlackOakTV (YC S21) – Netflix for black people

#849

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Not black-owned" I have to admit, I would have more sympathy with their cause if they weren't so openly racist. I am in favour of freedom of opinion, though, so if they want "black owned" producers, they are certainly entitled to it.

To a community whose origin revolves around the value of their labor going entirely to violent oppressors, ownership structure of enterprises that claim to represent them is understandably prized.

So they consider white people to still be slave owners?

Sorry I think it is racist, no matter how you turn it. I think it is a way backwards, not forward. But again, if that is what they want, OK.

Would it be beneficial for the black community if other communities started doing the same? So white people would prefer to do business with "white owned" businesses?

Re: Launch HN: BlackOakTV (YC S21) – Netflix for black people

#850

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a teen in the early 90s, I distinctly remember significant campaigns against violence represented in TV, movies, video games, and music. There were several congressional hearings demonizing Mortal Kombat, rap music, Doom, etc. Now as a parent with a tween and younger kids, my understanding of the current state of the science is that there still is no overwhelming consensus on increased violence related to media, h…

> 30 years later Mortal Kombat is the number one fighting game franchise of all time Smash Bros and Street Fighter are probably more popular actually. Mortal Kombat really, really sucked between 3 and 7. MK started to get good again around 8, but really it was "Injustice" (which used Mortal Kombat's engine) that made people start taking MK seriously again. MK9 is a modern, competitive fighter. But its not as well res…

https://www.denofgeek.com/games/mortal-kombat-best-selling-f...

Edit: Mortal Kombat’s major advantage over Smash is that it’s available on every platform. I think Street Fighter’s problem is that Capcom doesn’t bump the version, so it’s non obvious how Super Street Fighter V Arcade Edition is different from Street Fighter V (which also had a bungled release).

Of the three SF would be my preferred franchise, but sales suggest WB is doing something right.

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