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The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

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Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#831

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ultimately the question is just: would you prefer to have a competent or incompetent government? Is this a joke? Have you looked at the current administration?

Haha, true, although I meant competent from a tech perspective. The reason Palantir is even in the building is because the government is notoriously bad at technology. You need to separate government institutions ability to use tech from Trumps obvious buffoonery.

I am thinking that whether I want a technically competent federal government depends entirely on who I think will be running it in the future. Right now the technical incompetence, such that it exists, works to our advantage.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#832

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is what happens when one allows oneself to hide in "safe spaces" (like HN) where there's a "no politics" rule enabling people to hide and avoid being confronted with the ramifications of their actions. The entire world runs on technology now. It's all inherently political.

Yes, HN is my safe space. I have enough politics in my daily life, I don't need it when I'm with phone in my bed trying to wind down. And which politics? American internal politics are foreign and distant to me. How much do you care about my country internal affairs? Probably not much. And it's OK, you can't fix every country in existence, and if you tried to care you would get insane.

> How much do you care about my country internal affairs? Probably not much.

Oh how I wish this were true of non-Americans.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#833

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The perspective that is constantly missing from these one-sided ICE threads on HN and Reddit (but often exposed in videos after the fact): What are the civilians/protesters actually doing in these situations? This kind of "I'm a sovereign citizen, you can't touch me" behavior used to be rightfully belittled by the same crowd only a few years ago.

It’s insane. I watch the actual source videos from as many angles as I can find, and I’ve not once seen this false narrative of unreasonable retribution by LEO’s. Not once when I find the full context.

Same. I'm not american, but I see the same thing from the same crowd in my home country. They tend to think it's perfectly ok to lie if it's for a good thing (as defined by themselves).

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#834

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, go for the first one where ICE shoots a pastor directly in the head from a rooftop with a pepper ball (their claimed reason was they were blocking a vehicle, but in the video the pastor is on the sidewalk and there is no vehicle in sight anywhere. Also, that is not the way that sort of weapon is supposed to be used for crowd control as it could seriously injure someone).

Thanks for that. Here’s what I’ve found for the governments response: - Demonstrators were throwing rocks and bottles, and shooting fireworks at ICE agents. - Demonstrators were blocking vehicles, impeding ICE operations. - The demonstrators were trespassing on federal property and were repeatedly warned before force was used. I have been unable to find anything claiming those are false. Let me know if you have a sou…

I hear you on the “maybe they threw rocks/blocked vehicles/got warned” list (but that’s basically DHS’s standard script in every crowd-control incident.)

Two things:

The video of the pastor getting hit doesn’t match that story in that moment. I don’t see an imminent threat that would justify rooftop agents firing pepper balls into a crowd and someone getting tagged in the head, do you?

More importantly:

A federal judge also wasn’t just like “sounds fine to me.” This went to court, and the judge issued a TRO/preliminary injunction restricting exactly this kind of conduct (indiscriminate force and targeting peaceful protesters/press/clergy who aren’t posing an immediate threat). That is strong evidence that the court thought the pastor had a serious case and that ongoing harm was likely.

So even if we grant (for the sake of argument) “some people were doing dumb/illegal stuff somewhere,” that still doesn’t justify shooting projectiles into a crowd in a way that predictably risks serious injury (especially head/face hits). “We can’t aim these well” is not a defense, it’s literally the reason you shouldn’t be firing them like that, right?

Also worth saying: a TRO/PI isn’t a final “verdict,” but it’s still a judge basically telling the government “you can’t keep doing this while the case plays out.” That should tell you something about how convincing the government’s version looked when it mattered.

If you’ve got a source showing rocks/fireworks/clear warnings right before that rooftop volley in the same spot, please link it. I’d be happy to look. But between the video and the fact a judge stepped in, I’m siding with the pastor’s account here.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#835

Can someone tell me three things, please! - is ICE illegal or immoral ? Or it is a good tool used wrong ? - can people vote and make ICE stronger / weaker depending on their choice ? - are non registered people breaking the law or not ? Is it basically bad law or bad people ? I am sure US is republic and democracy together, but everyone here pretends ICE is a tool of dictatorship and should be stopped immediately. If…

> Or it is a good tool used wrong

This. ICE serves a necessary function. It is intentionally being wielded with malice. The target is not immigrants, they are just the face of the brawl, the real target is democratic voters.

> can people vote and make ICE stronger / weaker depending on their choice

This question is easy to answer. The citizens could easily vote in a new president in 2028 who defunded ICE altogether. We already know that cutting funds is way easier than granting them.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#836
post #717

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

They’re arrested and charged with appropriate offenses, e.g. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cwyg3j2kvzdo.amp Renee Nicole wasn’t driving a car at anyone, but regardless, it is stupid to shoot someone who’s driving a car at you as it won’t stop the car. What you need to do in that situation is get out of the way.

Here are several English cops run down with cars.

https://www.gmp.police.uk/news/greater-manchester/news/news/...

https://www.the-independent.com/news/uk/crime/simranjit-kajl...

https://www.itv.com/news/granada/2025-01-28/teen-charged-aft...

Your comments on these?

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#837

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep hearing this idea that boiling over lets them double down, but at the same time, it is not acceptable to let them keep doing what they do. Once the government starts using physical violence against the people and openly violating constitutional law, there is no choice, but to push back. But that pushback can look different. Personally, I think that needs to be a massive general strike across every major city.

Totally fine with general strikes, particularly for the business that are accommodating and providing logistical services for ICE. Very much opposed to shooting wars. We don't have the firepower or the political power (yet).

biophysboy says "Very much opposed to shooting wars. We don't have the firepower or the political power (yet)."

Who is the "We" in your statement? Are you talking about insurrection?

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#838

Can someone tell me three things, please! - is ICE illegal or immoral ? Or it is a good tool used wrong ? - can people vote and make ICE stronger / weaker depending on their choice ? - are non registered people breaking the law or not ? Is it basically bad law or bad people ? I am sure US is republic and democracy together, but everyone here pretends ICE is a tool of dictatorship and should be stopped immediately. If…

> Or it is a good tool used wrong This. ICE serves a necessary function. It is intentionally being wielded with malice. The target is not immigrants, they are just the face of the brawl, the real target is democratic voters. > can people vote and make ICE stronger / weaker depending on their choice This question is easy to answer. The citizens could easily vote in a new president in 2028 who defunded ICE altogether.…

>The citizens could easily vote in a new president in 2028 who defunded ICE altogether.

You think that after two more years of this regime that any such candidate would be allowed anywhere near whatever pretense of an electoral system still exists?

I need you to understand that the United States is already no longer a democratic republic in anything but name. The system of government you're assuming will fix the mess will have been entirely dismantled by then. The time to fix this within the system was in 2024.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#839

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can you watch the protest and organization in MN and conclude people are "just letting it happen". Quite the opposite.

Sorry, bad wording. I was using the "you all" in the same context as the parent's "collective we". Yes, there's tens of thousands out in the streets protesting, but also yes there's tens of millions who aren't.

I think it's millions, not tens of thousands protesting.

I hate that the online world is so polluted with America Bad that we cannot even have a good discussion. There is literally nothing American citizens could be doing right now that would meet with approval from outsiders.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#840
post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, and from the outside, the rest of the world is watching you all just let it happen.

A lot of the world would not tolerate the amount of illegals that the US has within its borders.

You are getting downvoted, but this is a fair point. The only other country with a higher estimate for illegal immigrant population is Russia. The next closest Western European country is France, with barely over half the rate of the US. [0]

[0] https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/percentag...

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