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EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

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Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#831

Post by nottorp »

reaperducer wrote: post #253
Karunamon wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Full devils advocate here, but the argument I've always heard is that the play store is a lot less arbitrary and restrictive than the App Store, so there's less reason to want to go outside of it. Apple locks out so many useful kinds of software that there actually may be enough momentum for real alternate app stores to proliferate.

Apple locks out so many useful kinds of software For someone who doesn't have a personal Android phone, what useful software is out there that I can get on an iPhone? Related: What mass-market software is out there that isn't available on the iPhone? I don't mean *nix tools and niche game emulators. Things that would make many people actually care about alt stores?

No uBlock Origin for one.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#832

Post by nottorp »

threeseed wrote: post #476
depressedpanda wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For someone who doesn't have a personal Android phone, what useful software is out there that I can get on an iPhone? A web browser that isn't a hamstrung reskin of Safari, and that can run uBlock Origin.

You do understand that uBlock Origin has private, profit-generating relationships with advertisers. And you want them to have full access to every URL that you visit ? Rather than use AdGuard or any other ad-blocker that can't go and sell your data to third parties for money.

> You do understand that uBlock Origin has private, profit-generating relationships with advertisers.

That's uBlock without Origin. Careful where you download your ad blockers from.

Edit: I'd also love a DaisyDisk that works on iOS. It will never get permission to get on the app store. Of course, that kind of app IS a huge security issue so I'd be very careful where I get it from.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#833

Post by TimPC »

ericmay wrote: post #67
izacus wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And now you'll be able to choose WHILE still keep using iOS which is much better for you as a consumer. This being bad for "regular people" is typical monopolistic corporate scaremongering. Apple has proven that they're more than capable of providing secure devices that provide choice with their MacBook series.

Kind of. So the primary issue is that Apple collectively bargains on behalf of customers against developers. So if you take something like privacy rights, Apple can say "hey, we've got all of these users and if you want to participate in the ecosystem you have to not track their data" - as an example. Now what happens is that companies like Facebook and others who really want to get your data without that pesky Apple…

Except even with a third-party app store Apple still has control over what permissions apps need as well as the developer API itself. So it's not clear to me that a third-party app store can ignore privacy without getting a user to click Allow to whatever privacy violations the API permits. I guess Apple can no longer enforce that apps can't use parts of the internal API that leak, so a third-party app store might get around some things that way but it seems they are still quite limited in options.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#834

Post by nottorp »

Karunamon wrote: post #359
reaperducer wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple locks out so many useful kinds of software For someone who doesn't have a personal Android phone, what useful software is out there that I can get on an iPhone? Related: What mass-market software is out there that isn't available on the iPhone? I don't mean *nix tools and niche game emulators. Things that would make many people actually care about alt stores?

In addition to everything the others mentioned already, anything that's not a web browser that might at some point show NSFW content. Applications like Discord and Tumblr been forced to make ux-degrading changes to comply with this Victorian-era prudishness. (and before you mention an application you know of that doesn't have this problem, remember that Apple's enforcement and reading of the rules compares unfavorabl…

Yeah, if as a consequence what you can do iOS/Mac OS stops being censored according to US puritan values, that would be a plus.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#835

Post by account42 »

ajaimk wrote: post #117
VyseofArcadia wrote: post #85

I really hope Sony and Nintendo are classified as gatekeepers as well because this > Allow users to install apps from third-party app stores and sideload directly from the internet. would be huge for Playstation and Switch owners.

While I want this to be true, consoles only exist because of game revenue. Not sure a $2000 PS5 is as appealing

I'd be OK with the current locked down consoles not existing. Having people buy two or three functionally almost identical devices so that they can use all the software they want is wasteful and not something we should protect as a society.

If an up front $2000 fee is too much for people to bear then console manafactuers can offer loans directly instead of hiding them in the game prices - that way people will at least be informed about what they are paying.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#836

Post by kaba0 »

sircastor wrote: post #669
arvinsim wrote: post #649

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you saying that old people who have difficulty figuring a phone will suddenly become a techie that can find an obscure setting? Complete FUD. Stop fearmongering.

No, they don't just "Find an obscure setting". A website tells them exactly where to look, exactly what to do, and they have motive to do it because they want whatever this app is promising. These kinds of scams are all over the place. Open up your browser's developer console while on Facebook and you'll see FB's desperate attempt to get you to not start typing in commands. When Epic got up in arms about Google's fee…

They can’t even follow how to call me up through facebook, do you honestly believe they will accidentally turn on the equivalent of Android dev mode? If Apple want to make it hard to access, they can.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#837

Post by thrown_22 »

oblio wrote: post #823
thrown_22 wrote: post #663

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What extreme? Letting people decide what permissions on their apps is the middle ground. The extremes are letting Apple decide what you can and can't run on your phone, or letting apps decide what you can or can't run on your phone. That some people are too ignorant to set phone permissions is their problem. We still sell sharp knives even though people cut themselves all the time. Demanding Apple protect us is the d…

There's a ton of regulation for knives and everything you can think of, and where there isn't, we call it "the Wild West" and it's not a compliment.

You must be British to think that licenses for knife buying are normal.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#838

Post by Aerroon »

SiempreViernes wrote: post #544
stjohnswarts wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a byproduct it does give a measure of privacy so what's it to you if apple users just don't care about your idea of freedom? I hope this European legislation at least lets apple customers opt-IN to these new features or choose the old way of doing business. I would prefer to keep access footprints to a minimum to stuff like NFC, contacts, hardware APIs, apple pay, etc on my phone.

In the EU privacy is assured by actual legislation in the form of the GDPR, and I expect Apple can get away with demanding compliance with that set of laws before putting something in the appstore if they really worry about privacy.

And you think words on a piece of paper are going to be enough? You can't legislate privacy into existence if you're constantly broadcasting all the data yourself. It's better to not broadcast the data in the first place, but that's not the route we've chosen.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#839

Post by kaba0 »

FredPret wrote: post #658
arvinsim wrote: post #649

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you saying that old people who have difficulty figuring a phone will suddenly become a techie that can find an obscure setting? Complete FUD. Stop fearmongering.

Read again and reinterpret. Old people will get sent a link to the “new official tax app” and be screwed six ways to Sunday.

And it can happen today as well via a website. That’s why some countries mandate two-factor authentication for example, which is a proper solution, not this “let’s sell overpriced tamagotchis” security theater.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#840

Post by account42 »

jahewson wrote: post #296
amelius wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with these big companies is that they tend to produce useful stuff for the average consumer only. But if they were broken up into smaller companies that created stuff that other businesses can use to build more products, I think we would have a more modular economy with far more choice than the current duopoly offers.

If you’re producing consumer devices you need scale. Huge scale. Niece companies catering to specific audiences sounds great but without scale, the prices would be an order of magnitude higher than you’re used to paying. Modularity itself is costly as integration is one of the main factors driving down consumer devise prices.

You need scale for the hardware part but not nearly as much scale for the OS and barely and for the apps. That's why these should not be tied together, so that we can have specialists Apps and operating system that do not have the scale to afford their own hardware platform.
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