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Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

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Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#831
post #764

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dude, there were pipe bombs and militia boys with guns and handcuffs. The rest of the crowd aside, I’m pretty sure this was supposed to be a show. Not comparable. We were close to a congressional decapitation on live TV.

> We were close to a congressional decapitation on live TV. In 2017 a lone left-wing activist caused more Congressional casualties than thousands of militia boys invading the Capitol.

If we're going to start enumerating domestic terrorist incidents, there's the Charleston church massacre, the Wal-Mart massacre in Texas, and the synagogue massacre in Pennsylvania. All of these incidents were linked to white supremacist ideas that the right has been flirting with for decades. Trump has just been dispensing with the dog whistles.

All four of these incidents had white perpetrators, btw. To extrapolate from mainstream Republican positions, we clearly need a complete and total shutdown of all white immigration until we figure out what is going on.

Back to the present day: the climate of lies about the election from Republican leadership up to and including Trump was obviously a factor in the violence in DC. On top of that Trump was there that day, speaking to that crowd immediately before they took action, directly inciting them to violence. There's no deniability to be had.

Appeasement has only emboldened these people to attack America, it's institutions, it's people, and it's values. We must have law and order, and that requires accountability for Trump and his enablers.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#832

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would there be? People can see each other, it's very common for a first mover to set off a rush.

Oh yeah ? And all happens on the same day ? How peculiar.

It's not peculiar at all. Different people have been asking them to do that for a long time, pointing out that social media platforms were being misused to spread propaganda, but their requests were refused.

Then there's a historically unprecedented incident stemming from Trump's dispute of the lection results, organized by him on social media, and initiated by his speech on Wednesday morning. I see nothing peculiar about multiple companies independently arriving at similar conclusions and following Twitter's lead.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#833
post #613

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's all pretty complicated, but one obvious mitigating factor is the ends being pursued by each movement. Rioting aside, BLM is ultimately pushing for justice and equality. There's also a question of blame - many would argue that most of the BLM rioting was provoked by a disproportionate police response. This movement, on the other hand, is quite transparently rooted in white supremacy, and had an explicit goal of t…

I don’t think you need to put moral or political judgments on this. As I understand (and I have not really done my homework here), there are two reasonably objective distinctions here: 1. The BLM protests were planned, in public at least, as peaceful protests. Things went wrong and they didn’t all end up peaceful and law-abiding, but I did not see any reports of people using major internet platforms to plan to start…

The BLM protests were based on objective lies. Have you watched the whole bodycam video of George Floyd's death? Or is that main stream media told you it's true that the police knee on his neck because he is black?

https://youtu.be/lJlQvOgEx58

Can you finish watching it and tell me which part of it is racist? It's unfortunately now people pick the lies they want to believe and claim it's the truth.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#834

Earlier quoted context omitted.

70% of the country is sick of being threatened by the other 30%.

I didn't realize people were forced to use Parlor. This isn't about maintaining peace on their platforms or to protect users. Its about controling all conversations, everywhere

Give this a read: https://www.mediaite.com/news/pro-trump-lawyer-lin-wood-call...

I don't know if Mike Pence uses Parler, but if pro-Trump lawyer and right wing influencer Lin Wood is calling for his execution, don't you think that represents something of a risk to Pence whether or not he reads it?

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#835
post #830

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? Last time I checked, BLM app ( https://apps.apple.com/us/app/black-lives-matter/id955318790 ) is on Apple store and the group has, among other notable events, burning Kenosha done on their bucket list. Google, Apple, FB, Twitter et al have zero issues supporting violence as long it supports a given side. I don't buy the analogy ( mostly because most analogies are crap ). Normal people try thought experiments and…

youre mischaracterizing BLM. Parler posts were actively calling for violence and government overthrow. The mob at the capitol set up a gallows and were carrying handcuffs. To the (limited) extent that BLM protests turned violent, it was the result of situations on the ground getting out of hand, not planned in advance or incited by leadership. (Also, much of it was the result of aggression by police). There's certain…

Eh. I honestly do not think I am, but let me do a quick DDG to not rely on memory alone:

Portland 01/02/21 - reports of molotov cocktails, fireworks, fires - I don't know about you, but use of explosive materials does tend to sound violent. You don't really come with a firebomb with no intent to use it.

Seatle 07/27/20 - reports of fires, 59 injured officers

Kenosha 08/25/20 - riots, destruction of property including fires including courthouse, incitement for more violence

I don't think I have to mention Chicago or NY..

And this is just a cursory check.

In BLM defense, they initially suffered from the same issues anonymous did. Literally anyone could be their spokesporson so right wing media got lovely quotes about purpose and goals of BLM such as ( some of those come from their official website ):

-Destruction comes before rebuilding, that’s what we talking about here -“Yes, I think the statues of the white European they claim is Jesus should also come down,” the activist posted via Twitter on Monday. “They are a form of white supremacy. Always have been.”“Tear them down.” -We believe and understand that Black people will never achieve liberation under the current global racialized capitalist system. -‘we will burn down this system’ -'MacCallum asked Newsome what Black Lives Matter hoped to achieve through violence." “Wow, it’s interesting that you would pose that question like that,” Newsome responded, “because this country is built upon violence. What was the American Revolution? What’s our diplomacy across the globe?”

Now you will note that their website is cleaned up and no longer contains notes about - forgot what terminology they used - abandoning existing familial structures and building new utopian world. It is a shame they took it down. It could open some eyes. I guess someone told them they need rebranding.

So maybe you are right. They are different after all. BLM is worse that Trump crazies. At least Capitol assholes will be picked up by various agencies and prosecuted. BLM members may have been arrested, but various Dem operatives ensured they are out as soon as possible. Hell, some were raising money for bails.

In other words, I do not think you have a clear picture of BLM, who they are, or even what they were doing.

So I this my comparison is valid.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#836
post #798
post #747

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've banned this account for continuing to do political flamewar after we specifically asked you not to. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25695444

So dissenting is now considered doing political flamewar? Ok.

Gratuitous provocation and name-calling are not dissent. You can express dissenting views without doing those things, and users here are required to.

There is a link, though: people with minority/contrarian opinions are sometimes so frustrated with the majority that they lash out in frustration in ways that break the site guidelines. People with majority opinions don't usually do it that way. They're more likely to be self-righteous. Either way, though, users here need to follow the guidelines regardless of what their opinions are.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#837
post #788

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are good arguments against free speech absolutism, but this is not one of them, since child pornography IS protected speech in the US. You can write a book of poetry that has entire chapters featuring Achilles and the Tortoise raping babies in patently offensive detail. If Congress tried to pass a law that bans your book, it would easily pass the Miller test, and the Court would tell them to think again. Heck,…

So, you're saying that anyone can write an entire book on overthrowing the government and sell it on amazon, but Twitter has silenced however many million people? It sure sounds like there are easy avenues for people to share ideas.

Not sure what argument you're trying to make here.

If the state would use its influence to get one single bookstore in Bumsworth, Arizona to stop selling one specific book on repairing video cameras [2], that would certainly be a free speech issue, and it would certainly violate the First Amendment.

Yes, even if the book remained available in every other bookstore across the nation, and every book discussing other ways of repairing video cameras would remain available for sale in Bumsworth. Just imagine a state attorney trying to use that as a defense, to explain why the "No Video Camera Repairs in Bumsworth Act" does not violate the First Amendment. It would be ridiculous.

You're trying to use the same defense while the leaders of the largest soon-to-be-opposition party are banned en masse in an effort to align industry with the incoming new administration, while people with significant cred [1], who happen to be on bad terms with opposition party in question [3] denounce the whole thing as an "unacceptable act of censorship".

[1] https://nypost.com/2021/01/09/russian-dissident-alexei-naval... https://twitter.com/navalny/status/1347969772177264644

[2] more pertinently, a book about the acts of the Catholic Church in Bumsworth, or the mafia connections of the mayor of Bumsworth

[3] https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-05/donald-trump-us-has-n...

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#838
post #831
post #764

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We were close to a congressional decapitation on live TV. In 2017 a lone left-wing activist caused more Congressional casualties than thousands of militia boys invading the Capitol.

If we're going to start enumerating domestic terrorist incidents, there's the Charleston church massacre, the Wal-Mart massacre in Texas, and the synagogue massacre in Pennsylvania. All of these incidents were linked to white supremacist ideas that the right has been flirting with for decades. Trump has just been dispensing with the dog whistles. All four of these incidents had white perpetrators, btw. To extrapolate…

> We must have law and order

Absolutely

> that requires accountability for Trump and his enablers.

Absolutely not. It's words like that that truly frighten me. Have you lost your good sense?

What truly worries me is this part: "his enablers".... what exactly are you saying? That voting for Trump was a crime? That supporting Trump was a crime? That protesting for Trump (but not engaging in violence nor tresspass) was... what.. Terrorism (as the media is now trying to suggest)? No, no it was most definately not. It is very dangerous to use loose words like this which can be interpreted in too many ways, especially now. If you mean to say that Trump committed a specific crime and had co-conspirators, explain it that way and name the conspirators. Otherwise you are going to have a huge percentage of the population believe that you intend to "round them up into camps" or "line them up against the wall" or other things that other very dangerous people have tweeted. Trump supporters will defend themselves, potentially pre-emptively (just like how the war between the states started) and nobody wants that.

I don't associate with a political tribe, I didn't like Trump, and I left America long ago. But I've cautioned my mother who still lives there and who supported Trump all the way (she believes all the nutty theories, but isn't a bad person) that she needs to plan an escape route into Canada. Because I truly fear for her life at this point. Biden and the media keep wrongly using the word "Terrorism" in order to (I'm quite sure) invoke special governmental powers that allow them to suspend all civil and human rights from... who? ... all Trump supporters? And PATRIOT-ACT V2 has landed, all premeditated and prepared, ready for a huge draconian power grab.

Nobody has demonstrated that Trump has committed any crime (AFAIK). I'm sure there will be attempts. But nobody has even pointed to a credible suspected crime (AFAIK). Well respected constitutional lawyers like Alan Dershowitz have weighed in with clear opinion that Trump doesn't need to pardon himself because he has not committed any legally cognisable crime. And that his speeches were not incitement to violence... and Alan gives a long history of speeches that resulted in violence... and America has always punished the violence doers, not speakers, being extremely hesitant to invoke "incitement to violence." In this case it's laughably far from such.. he said walk, he urged peace, he only called for a protest.

But I'm positive many people will attempt to "require accountability for Trump." Go ahead, do so via the court system using the laws of the land. Both political tribes will support that.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#839
post #823

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting, I didn't know that. So a business can actually deny a service depending on political affiliation. Of-course this can be challenged in the courts. Well, unless, it's protected by 230.

The answer depends on what state and city the business is located in. Political affiliation is a protected class in some states[0]. California[1], for example, also prohibits discrimination on gender identity, ancestry, sexual orientation, AIDS/HIV status, medical condition, political activities or affiliation, veteran status, or status as a stalking victim. [0] https://www.ncsl.org/research/labor-and-employment/disc…

Neither of those linked sets if laws apply to customers. Only to employees.

Re: Google suspending Parler from the Google Play store

#840
post #829

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meaning I can post a sign "No Trump Voters Allowed" on my restaurant?

Political affiliation is a protected class in California[0] but this may be legal in some states. [0] https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/california-employmen...

That's only for employers discriminating against employees. It doesn't apply to customers -- a business can almost always refuse to do business with you, for almost any reason. Example: you can get thrown out of a restaurant for not adhering to a dress code.
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