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GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

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Re: GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

#821

Post by seba_dos1 »

palata wrote: post #694
seba_dos1 wrote: post #545

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're confused. To quote Google's documentation: > To build an Android-compatible mobile device, follow this three-step process: > 1. Using AOSP, implement Android on your device. > 2. Ensure your device complies with the Android Compatibility Definition Document. The CDD enumerates the software and hardware requirements for an Android-compatible device. > 3. Pass the Compatibility Test Suite (CTS). Use the CTS as a…

Just like Linux can mean "the Linux kernel" or "a Linux distribution" in "common use of the terms", Android can mean "a device that can legally be advertised using the Android trademark" or "whatever looks like Android to people". Now when someone says "Break free from Android... by installing Android?", either they are having fun by using the two different meanings in the same sentence, or they are confused and genu…

You're vigorously defending a poorly thought out title by inventing irrelevant contexts and falsely accusing multiple people of being wrong because they claimed such uncontroversial things like "AOSP is Android". Sure, if we want to be strictly correct then AOSP is not Android, but rather the name of a Google project that distributes the source code of Android - but that's not how the term is commonly used in these discussions nor how you used it either.

What people objected to is the concept of "breaking free from Android" by using a distribution of Google-developed Android. Interpreting the title as "break free from flavors of Android that can use the Google's trademark in their marketing; here's one that can't" is just ridiculous and not what anyone will think about when reading it. The current one ("break free from Google") is still objectionable, but slightly less since one could perhaps make a somewhat correct point that relying on Google-developed codebase that's soft-forked by someone else actually is significant enough step away from using something that comes straight from Google and tightly integrates with their proprietary services. It's still quite obviously hyperbolic, especially when actual non-Android alternatives also exist.

Re: GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

#822

Post by sandreas »

Handrail wrote: post #579
sandreas wrote: post #115

I personally tend to own two Phones. One all-day carry GrapheneOS device (Pixel 8) and an older WiFi and at home only iPhone for all payment and ensurance stuff. This is inconvenient in some ways, but at least it is sort of privacy as good as it gets while still being able to run official apps when I need them at home. To de-google the phone, I use F-Droid as primary App store, Aurora as fallback for non-f-droid Apps…

I like your recommendations mostly, just wanted to point out that Organic Maps has had a falling out with the Open Source community that built it, so I wouldn't use that anymore. The community fork is called 'CoMaps' now.

Great... I consider this for my next App listing. Unfortunately there is no edit option at the moment. Since I don't use Organic Maps any more, I just remembered it being the most usable alternative.

Comaps seems to have a lot of benefits though.

Re: GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

#823

Post by sandreas »

epistasis wrote: post #564
sandreas wrote: post #115

I personally tend to own two Phones. One all-day carry GrapheneOS device (Pixel 8) and an older WiFi and at home only iPhone for all payment and ensurance stuff. This is inconvenient in some ways, but at least it is sort of privacy as good as it gets while still being able to run official apps when I need them at home. To de-google the phone, I use F-Droid as primary App store, Aurora as fallback for non-f-droid Apps…

Thanks for this, it's so helpful for people trying out a new platform. I'd love to have something like this for Linux desktops as well. Maybe a website that has app-lists, where people can then potentially add info about their use cases and reasoning for their choices. Could be a great subreddit! I tried Omarchy specifically because installed an opionated selection of apps to covered most bases, and it got me started…

Maybe you might want to try out my zarch[1] repo, which is a Linux on ZFSBootMenu installer script for ArchLinux with configurable profiles - basically a folder with some package listings.

The t480s profile is my personal Notebook config, which is not fully up to date but probably a pretty good start. You can also only take a look at the archpkg.txt and the aurpkg.txt to see the packages that I'm using.

1: https://github.com/sandreas/zarch

Re: GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

#824

Post by izacus »

monksy wrote: post #757
izacus wrote: post #524

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'll quickly find out - as people are finding out in EU nowadays - that *no* bank will go through the trouble of fighting checklist security auditors to keep your linuxes working. Wait till you find out that your prefered Linux bank won't have the same mortgage terms as you'd like and you'll be running to buy a Google/Apple phone to get those % down.

Keep complaining to the regulators that you're being locked out of your account. Sue them and keep escalating. Forcing you into a system where you have to pay, maintain, etc for access is often not legal.

The regulators are the ones that support device attestation and security measures though.

Re: GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

#825

Post by realusername »

Aachen wrote: post #794
realusername wrote: post #648

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See https://support.google.com/googleplay/android-developer/answ... for Android and https://developer.apple.com/documentation/adsupport/asidenti... for iOS

You're linking to Google Play's documentation, not Android code itself that GrapheneOS etc. are built upon You can find hardware identifiers exposed by Linux distributions more than by Android itself. That Google adds a nice sauce on top... yeah that's a sorry state of affairs, but an optional layer if you don't use the stock OS if it ships with Google Play edit: but I appreciate looking it up nonetheless! I wasn't c…

You can't really use Android without the Google Play anyways so that's a moot point, none of the popular apps will work. Google Play is very much a core part of the Android OS.

Even EOS and GrapheneOS realized that themselves.

Re: GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

#826

Post by jcul »

Handrail wrote: post #579
sandreas wrote: post #115

I personally tend to own two Phones. One all-day carry GrapheneOS device (Pixel 8) and an older WiFi and at home only iPhone for all payment and ensurance stuff. This is inconvenient in some ways, but at least it is sort of privacy as good as it gets while still being able to run official apps when I need them at home. To de-google the phone, I use F-Droid as primary App store, Aurora as fallback for non-f-droid Apps…

I like your recommendations mostly, just wanted to point out that Organic Maps has had a falling out with the Open Source community that built it, so I wouldn't use that anymore. The community fork is called 'CoMaps' now.

Isn't organic maps itself a community fork of maps.me?

Re: GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

#827

Post by sambf »

Gormo wrote: post #247
bramhaag wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some other FOSS apps I use daily: Aegis - 2FA ( https://github.com/beemdevelopment/Aegis ) Breezy Weather - A very good looking weather app ( https://github.com/breezy-weather/breezy-weather ) OnlyOffice Documents - MS Office suite replacement ( https://github.com/ONLYOFFICE/documents-app-android ) Fossify Calendar ( https://github.com/FossifyOrg/Calendar ) Fossify Messages ( https://github.com/FossifyOrg/Messages )…

Some others that I use: * NextCloud -- client for personal NextCloud server; this app is used primarily for file sync, with other features accessed with other apps. ( https://nextcloud.com/features/?filter=Clients#android-clien... ) * KeePassDX -- password manager, shares DB with KeePassXC on desktop, which is synced via NextCloud. Also functions as a TOTP authenticator. ( https://www.keepassdx.com/ ) * DAVx5 -- CalD…

I'd add that KDE Connect works great with Gnome too

Re: GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

#828

Post by alwyn »

bergheim wrote: post #105

Been using this for about a year on a p9 pro. It works very well. I hear the google tap to pay does not work, but I've never tried it. However Vipps with their tap to pay works fine. BankID works but not with biometric login, which some things require IIRC. And for some reason DnB private works fine, but you are not allowed in on the corp app. It's mind boggingly stupid that they lock down apps like this, when you ca…

For the tap to pay I am now using my Garmin smartwatch. Still corporate, but not Google/Apple huge corporate.

Very content with GOS otherwise. I blame app providers for their ridiculous limitations, not custom ROM developers.

Re: GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

#829

Post by palata »

Aachen wrote: post #802
palata wrote: post #676

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's like saying Tulip blocked I agree, but you are the one who talked about "blocking". I did not :-).

You called it a problem coming from the manufacturers. That implies they actively thwart it (woa, another new word! It's crazy how language works). But they don't actually have a problem with it; some of them are actively publishing the info needed for alternative OSes to work on their hardware and GrapheneOS needs only take it if they want to, but they don't. Who has a problem with whom here? Again, not saying Graph…

Would it work if I said "the ball is in the manufacturers' court"? Or would you complain that we're not talking about tennis?

Did you genuinely not understand my point, or are you just usually annoying and condescending with language?

> thwart it (woa, another new word! It's crazy how language works)

This is condescending.

Re: GrapheneOS – Break Free from Google and Apple

#830

Post by palata »

ysnp wrote: post #759
fsflover wrote: post #736

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree that such requirements are minimal. Nothing prevents running GrapheneOS on a device with lower requirements. It's a questionable choice by the developers restricting the choice for users.

It is not the job of GrapheneOS to lower their standards and deplete their resources supporting every phone under the sun. We already have LineageOS for that. I would rather not be snarky but I don't understand why people keep blaming GrapheneOS instead of the OEMs. Almost every single time.

I don't think that there is anyone to blame.

GrapheneOS has requirements that result in only the Pixels being supported. LineageOS has other requirements that result in most phones being supported.

I may wish that more devices met the requirements of GrapheneOS, because I like GrapheneOS and their requirements, but I find it very weird to with GrapheneOS changed their core vision. What makes GrapheneOS is those requirements.

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