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Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

missionlocal.org

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Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#821

Post by shadowgovt »

misssocrates wrote: post #718
Convolutional wrote: post #681

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After the murder, I had to read scores of comments like this ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35456168 ) about the homeless, need for more law enforcement (although the US already incarcerates more of its population than any industrialized country) etc. I had to read scores of tech bros in the professional-managerial class whinge about the poor, about black lives matter and how this was due to "progressivism".…

What percentage are entrepreneurs and what percentage are people with mental health problems and or drug addiction?

What percentage of what?

If you mean "What percentage of crimes are committed by," it's probably the second population. Probably. I'm actually pretty weak on that narrative right now.

If you mean "What percentage of the population described is committing violent crimes that should result in jail time," I'm even weaker on it. Because the homeless population is way, way larger than the tech-entrepreneur population, so by percentage of population I think it's a toss-up without hard numbers.

It doesn't take many dead executives on a yacht or strangled estranged wives to tilt the numbers when the population is small.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#822

Post by prpl »

gnicholas wrote: post #482
JieJie wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is great writing, "the abrupt closure of the mid-market Whole Foods, leaving San Franciscans just eight other Whole Foods within city limits". What a scoop, brilliantly delivered.

Sure, it's a cute jab, but 8 WFs in an entire city is not that many. Even if you have a car, there are large swaths of the city (Richmond, Sunset), where a WF is a bit of a slog during regular traffic (and worse during rush hour). And of course, many city dwellers don't have cars, so having to lug groceries up SF's famously hilly streets is not great for more than a fraction of a mile or so.

Haight WF is about as close as Masonic Trader Joe’s (and somehow easier to park at) for most in the richmond and sunset - though Calmart is better than both.

Andronico’s was much better than both before safeway took over

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#823

Post by olliej »

aeternum wrote: post #634
pentagrama wrote: post #437

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in doubt if is ethical journalism reveal the name and LinkedIn profile of an alleged killer, sounds like doxing to me.

Is the public's failure to understand the meaning of the word alleged a problem with journalism? The police arresting people in secret has historically been .. problematic at best.

There are two issues that compete:

1. Police secretly arrest people and toss them in jail never to be heard of again

2. People are erroneously arrested, there name is publicly attached to a crime through a bunch of reporting, then they're released before trial or found not guilty

The first is fairly clear, the 2nd is a problem because being released is generally not news, so google search or whatever forever links the persons name to a crime they didn't do. Then you have a bunch of humanisms: the person the lawyered there way out of the crime, or "they must have been involved otherwise why would they be arrested", etc. So there is a permanent cost to being publicly arrested for something you didn't do even if justice happens and you don't ever see court. That's why you some times see people in the judicial system releasing "this person is absolutely innocent" type press releases.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#824

Post by nemothekid »

yadaeno wrote: post #644
zenkat wrote: post #608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that says more about Hacker News than SF. There's a level of hate for the city here that I don't understand. Feels a bit like a vendetta sometimes.

It completely depends on where you live in SF. The people in the wealthy hyper gentrified areas are baffled that people would think the city is unsafe. Meanwhile people with less income are exposed daily to an epidemic of drug addiction, homeless, theft, mental illness, all problems with straightforward solutions that the residents are screaming for. Its not one or the other, its both. Just because you live in a safe…

What are the unsafe neighborhoods in SF?

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#825

Post by CTmystery »

dmode wrote: post #323

Am I the only one who does NOT feel unsafe in SF at all ? I mean, I choose not to walk in TL and SOMA at night. But why would anyone feel unsafe in North Beach, Marina, Russian Hill, Richmond, Sunset, GG park, Lower Haight, Valencia etc. I have spent many nights walking in Valencia and took Uber home at 2am. Doesn't feel remotely unsafe.

My mailman quit because he was robbed at gunpoint two blocks from my house, in broad daylight, in one of the neighborhoods you mention. https://sfstandard.com/criminal-justice/mail-carrier-robbed-...

I don't understand why it has to be "SF is perfectly safe" or "SF is a dystopian hellhole". Why not pick a middle ground?

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#826

Post by confidantlake »

renlo wrote: post #627
timmytokyo wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every major city has a crime problem and always has. The question is whether the situation is being blown out of proportion by sensationalist media or people with axes to grind. For a group that claims to be so rational, much of the HN crowd commenting here does seem to be averse to relying upon actual data.

Anecdotally whenever I hear a SF resident say the "crime problem is overblown", they almost always live in the nicer areas where there's virtually no crime. I lived on the border of the Tenderloin years ago, and saw things that I've never seen anywhere else. I knew a guy who was murdered in the Polk Gulch, I had my car broken into (and rummaged through multiple times after I started leaving the door unlocked), I had…

Yes I believe all these things, but that would be true in any other big city in the US. Try living in the bad areas of Saint Louis, Baltimore, New Orleans, Detroit, or Cleaveland. When San Francisco has article after article saying crime is "out of control" yet no one is writing articles about Alabama or Louisiana which objectively have higher murder rates, I would say, yes it is "overblown".

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#827

Post by yonran »

Pils wrote: post #740
j4pe wrote: post #20

Joe Eskenazi, the author of this piece, is a solid journalist who helps run the tiny donation-funded Mission Local. They've done incredible reporting on corruption in the SF city government and punch way above their weight in the stories they break. I have respect for how Joe refused to join in reporting this murder as evidence of a violent crime epidemic, while still reporting on homelessness and property crime.

The current CEO of YCombinator regarding an article in Mission Local a few days ago: Mission Local seems to serve their local bureaucratic masters over the basic public safety needs of the people. [0] This is gaslighting. You should be ashamed. [1] In this case they are “independent” of a sort [2] In all fairness, he did retweet this article a couple hours ago. [0] https://twitter.com/garrytan/status/1644520924828540…

The top part of Joe Eskenazi’s earlier article https://missionlocal.org/2023/04/bob-lee-crazy-bob-mobilecoi... was good (where he reported evidence that the Bob Lee killing was not a robbery), but I agree with Garry Tan that the bottom part of the article (where he makes a broader commentary on whether San Francisco is “safe” unrelated to Bob Lee) is gaslighting and reductionist. It makes many claims and implications that are questionable: e.g., that rampant property crime does not make you unsafe (despite the fact that many thieves are armed), that festering drug addiction does not make you unsafe (which may have been a contributing factor to the car not stopping for the victim), that the problem with crime is “feelings” rather than real risk, and that those who are concerned about crime must have come from sheltered “suburbs”. And there’s no mention of anti-Asian robberies that got the previous DA recalled.

Eskenazi is a well-connected journalist, but he is also arrogant and often presents only one side of issues. For example, virtually nothing that he wrote in this article (anonymously sourced from disgruntled politicians) about the magnet school Lowell High school ended up being true (magnet schools do not violate state code as claimed, and the school did return to test-based admission which he claimed would not happen) https://missionlocal.org/2022/02/lowells-old-merit-based-adm.... So while his reporting is mostly good, you have to be aware of his bias.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#828

Post by anigbrowl »

JimDabell wrote: post #630
timmytokyo wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every major city has a crime problem and always has. The question is whether the situation is being blown out of proportion by sensationalist media or people with axes to grind. For a group that claims to be so rational, much of the HN crowd commenting here does seem to be averse to relying upon actual data.

> Every major city has a crime problem and always has. This isn’t true. The idea that cities must inherently have crime problems is a form of learned helplessness. You think they must have crime problems because it’s all you’ve ever experienced. Try visiting a city that has low crime, like Singapore or Tokyo.

I think you should read the username of the person you're replying to.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#829

Post by awb »

francisofascii wrote: post #252
awb wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are two broad classifications. Any two broad classifications will have some overlap. I don’t think you’ve demonstrated that this overlap is any bigger than with any other random classification (hair color, height, type of car they drive , etc.).

Really? I would have to at least assume that people who have committed murders have, on average, a higher propensity for risk taking than the average person.

I’d guess higher rates of mental illness, trauma, exposure to violence, overwhelming emotional responses, impulsiveness and a greater value on short-term instead of long-term goals.

I know plenty of business/sports risk takers that have no criminal history. I really don’t think it’s in the top 10 most important factors.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#830

Post by confidantlake »

hnav wrote: post #820
confidantlake wrote: post #733

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For real. Avoid tenderloin and SOMA and everything else is fine.

In other words avoid density and transit. Best way to avoid bs in one of the densest cities in the US is to hang in the burbs.

The tenderloin is a tiny part of the city that is easily avoided. Plenty of dense places that are nice too.
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