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Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

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Re: Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

#821

Post by tallanvor »

noduerme wrote: post #797
courgette wrote: post #785

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for sanity. I do understand the specific of the US situation, I’ve leave there since the last decade. In a very touristy city to boot, so a large part of my social network rely on tips. But the lack of awareness from our US friends to understand that they are the exception, not the norm in that particular regard is a bit disconcerting.

Tipping is an evolved system. If you go to most countries outside the US, you are not expected to leave a tip. But if you do leave a tip, here is what you get: . You are the first person served, every time you walk in, no matter how crowded the bar is. . You are poured the extra liquor that a bartender is allowed to "spill" . When you bring your date to the restaurant next time, you are treated very well. It is true…

You'll get that in some places, sure, but not everywhere. In Norway if people see waiters/bartenders/servers treating other people better, they'll stop going there because the idea is that everyone should be treated equally. And bars are highly regulated - pouring stronger drinks than allowed is a quick way to get your liquor license revoked.

Re: Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

#822

Post by mnky9800n »

jacktribe wrote: post #626
mnky9800n wrote: post #597

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't feel like you responded to my comment. If you are paying a reasonable wage, profit sharing is a bonus. You are creating tipping with extra steps.

Profit sharing only works if you stick around long enough. In the service industry, and especially amongst young people, it's common to pick up a job like this for a few months and make some money, then move on to something else. And that's okay, not everyone wants to make a career out of making coffee. It's still a good formative experience to have, while earning some money, and there's no reason why you shouldn't d…

Then you are hiring the wrong people for the kind of coffee shop you claim to desire running. There are plenty of people who enjoy coffee enough to make a career out of it even if it's for a few years. You are pitching this evolved, pay every one a fair wage, this is a real place to work that's super cool, and then treating them like it's some chain. It's transparent. You don't expect them to work with you longer then a couple months. You want customers to track whether employees are doing good or not trying to create some BS KPIs or whatever and then use that to incentivize your employees. Everything you write in every one of your posts demonstrates that you seem to miss the entire point of a coffee shop. It should be a cool place to relax and read or work or meet friends while drinking coffee.

Re: Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

#823

Post by WastingMyTime89 »

noduerme wrote: post #797
courgette wrote: post #785

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for sanity. I do understand the specific of the US situation, I’ve leave there since the last decade. In a very touristy city to boot, so a large part of my social network rely on tips. But the lack of awareness from our US friends to understand that they are the exception, not the norm in that particular regard is a bit disconcerting.

Tipping is an evolved system. If you go to most countries outside the US, you are not expected to leave a tip. But if you do leave a tip, here is what you get: . You are the first person served, every time you walk in, no matter how crowded the bar is. . You are poured the extra liquor that a bartender is allowed to "spill" . When you bring your date to the restaurant next time, you are treated very well. It is true…

> But if you do leave a tip, here is what you get

I can assure you that an American tip here will give you a weird look and get you to be treated like a tourist which is not something you wish.

Re: Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

#824

Post by oblio »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #676
Renaud wrote: post #495

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just Japan. Basically most of the world except Noth America pay their waiters wages that don't depend on tips. Sure some places allow additional tipping, but it's not a mandatory fee and the workers don't have to get it to make a living.

The mandatory minimum wage where I live is $18.69/hr, which is higher than the median wage in many European countries. Any tips or mandatory service charges are always in addition to this and many waiters make more than the minimum wage. Replacing tipping with a 20% mandatory service charge -- tried many times here -- results in the employees earning less money, empirically. Eliminating tipping is unpopular with empl…

> The mandatory minimum wage where I live is $18.69/hr, which is higher than the median wage in many European countries. Any tips or mandatory service charges are always in addition to this and many waiters make more than the minimum wage.

It's about the social safety net, not just about raw cash.

The same waiter in most European countries would have health insurance even after being fired, for example.

Re: Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

#825

Post by pastacacioepepe »

holistio wrote: post #792

I live in Central Europe and I think our version of tipping makes a lot more sense than what's common in North America. If we receive exceptional service, we pay a little extra - usually 10% or less. Staff doesn't expect to be paid from tips, business owners don't expect their staff to be paid from tips, customers don't have a guilt trip because they feel like if they don't tip generously the staff will be underpaid.…

If you're an European waiter working in a touristic restaurant you get the best of both worlds. European pay and benefits plus large tips from unknowing USA tourists.

Re: Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

#826

Post by xutopia »

jacktribe wrote: post #99

I've just opened a coffee shop in Los Angeles last month, and we don't take tips. We only use self-ordering iPads (I've custom coded an iOS app w/ Stripe Terminal for it), and we don't accept cash either. We've had a few customers baffled by the no-tipping policy, and still insisting that they leave a tip. Some even left cash on the counter or on the table. We had to chase a few of them down to return their money. Al…

Think of turning things around with a simple sentence on the last screen: "We don't accept tips but gladly accept a smile."

Re: Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

#827

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

4gotunameagain wrote: post #524
dang wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should write a longer piece about your coffee shop! and the process behind it. If you do, you should submit it to HN - and if you do that you should email us (hn@ycombinator.com) because we might put it in the second-chance pool ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26998308 ).

I love how one person opened a coffee shop which basically operates like every single coffee shop in the world apart from the US , and you guys need a detailed write up, charts, flow charts, tips for the secret sauce :)

That's how we roll in the states. It doesn't matter that every other country on earth has been doing it a certain way for over a hundred years without issue, because we don't do it that way it is clearly a dangerously unproven method.

Re: Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

#828

Post by jaclaz »

4gotunameagain wrote: post #524
dang wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should write a longer piece about your coffee shop! and the process behind it. If you do, you should submit it to HN - and if you do that you should email us (hn@ycombinator.com) because we might put it in the second-chance pool ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26998308 ).

I love how one person opened a coffee shop which basically operates like every single coffee shop in the world apart from the US , and you guys need a detailed write up, charts, flow charts, tips for the secret sauce :)

Well, put aside the tips aspect, a coffee shop that provides self-ordering iPads and doesn't accept cash is not so common.

Re: Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

#829

Post by noduerme »

franciscop wrote: post #801
noduerme wrote: post #793

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Generational divide here. I used to work at Cacao coffeehouse in west LA in the 90s. Only took cash. Also, basically made no money other than tips. I moved to NYC and waited tables where there was no pay whatsoever other than tips. That was around when standard tipping went from 15% to 20%. Having worked in the service industry, I usually tip 25-30%, per drink or per meal. But here's the relevant point: When I encoun…

Why do you expect as a customer to have anything to say about a worker getting paid? Do you follow your shoes manufacturing process making sure everyone in the chain is paid properly? I expect the employer to pay properly, otherwise for the employee to take their case to their union/court. This concept/way of thinking seems so strange as a non-American. > My prediction is that by 2025 [...] You do know that for the r…

I think it's the customer's responsibility to know whether the person directly in front of them is being paid, or relying on the customer to pay. If you go into a strip club in whatever country you are in, do you expect to get a lap dance without tipping the girl? Because she's in the union or being paid by the strip club? Probably not. In some states in America, like New York, waiters are basically like strippers. If you go there, you should understand that the service costs extra. You wouldn't go into a Buddhist temple in Thailand and not leave some change at the door. You wouldn't go climb Mt Everest and not give a few dollars to the sherpa who carried your bag. So don't go to a restaurant in New York City and screw the wait staff. Budget it into your travels. This is a plain rule for traveling anywhere.

Re: Is tipping getting out of control? Many consumers say yes

#830

Post by pards »

jacktribe wrote: post #99

I've just opened a coffee shop in Los Angeles last month, and we don't take tips. We only use self-ordering iPads (I've custom coded an iOS app w/ Stripe Terminal for it), and we don't accept cash either. We've had a few customers baffled by the no-tipping policy, and still insisting that they leave a tip. Some even left cash on the counter or on the table. We had to chase a few of them down to return their money. Al…

> the prices they see on the menu is what they'll actually end up paying

Is the sales tax included in the listed price?

One of my pet peeves is how "tax and tip" are not included in the displayed prices in Ontario, Canada. I hate having to do arithmetic on every purchase I make.

I grew up in Sydney, Australia where what you see is what you pay - tax incl. Tipping is generally not part of the culture because the minimum wage is a livable wage (in most areas).

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