When tasers were introduced, isn’t this the exact problem they were here to solve? You use them instead of shooting to disable the suspect to de-escalate the same situations?
LAPD arrests man on suspicion of making deadly swatting call to Wichita police
821–830 of 864 posts
Re: LAPD arrests man on suspicion of making deadly swatting call to Wichita police
#822Earlier quoted context omitted.
You are reading too deep into it. The situation is that the cops have too little downside and too high an upside: since they never get convicted for these crimes, you need little to nothing to convince you that deadly force is fine. Cops need to go to jail for this. Its as simple as that. And they will find the way to not shoot like that anymore.
> you need little to nothing to convince you that deadly force is fine. I'm disturbed by that line of thought. A normally educated human being from a developed country should feel bad about using deadly force, and worse after using it. The whole point of military training is to break the human instinct no to kill and even with the pressure of actual combat situation (where the upside is much higher, the downside much…
US is hiring lots of former soldiers as LEO.
Also the training for the soldiers is not to break the human instinct not to kill (there is nothing like that), but to follow orders, react quickly under pressure, reduce the risk of panicking and to use superior tactics for killing the enemies. We train soldiers to be effective killing machines, nothing else. And many become LEO after retiring from the army.
Re: LAPD arrests man on suspicion of making deadly swatting call to Wichita police
#823Earlier quoted context omitted.
In general so many things can be misunderstood. E.g. when Jean Charles de Menezes was shot by anti-terror police in London who mistook him for a potential suicide bomber, one of the things brought up was how he got up from his seat in a rapid motion by lifting his arms in front of him to shift his point of gravity. It stands out to me because they thought it was weird, but to me it's just the easiest way to get up wh…
The initial claims made about Jean Charles de Menezes included that he ran, he jumped the barrier, he did not buy a ticket, he was wearing a thick jacket. In reality he walked, bought a ticket, used the barrier normally and was wearing a t-shirt. This is visible on the cctv footage.
Correction. No useful cctv footage was apparently available and he was wearing a denim jacket.
Re: LAPD arrests man on suspicion of making deadly swatting call to Wichita police
#824Earlier quoted context omitted.
Having seen the video, it looked more like he was trying to shield his eyes from the light the police was shining directly at him _from across the street_. I don't know why this isn't reported more accurately, they shot the guy from what looks like a good 20-30 meters away.
Because they're already laying the groundwork that it was his fault, not the trigger happy cops.
Right, I said "ostensibly" above, but the cynic in me thinks, "the police got ahead of the narrative by saying he moved first". I don't really know what happened (other than a person got shot by the police when they absolutely should not have).
Re: LAPD arrests man on suspicion of making deadly swatting call to Wichita police
#825Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Someone gave the kill order and a lot of shots were fired. I honestly don’t believe anyone gave a kill order, I rather feel (maybe not fairly) that police had guns trained on him and heard gun fire and instinctively pulled without even taking a second to analyze situation. If I’m right (good video footage could help prove the theory), this should scare everyone (but likely won’t).
So if someone throws a firecracker near an active US police situation all the officers are just going to open fire on whatever is in front of their gun barrels?
I probably shouldn’t have been that vague, knew I was leaving myself open to whataboutism / trolling. Here’s a bit more specific version:
“If a police officer hears and sees the perp’s gun go off, they likely won’t stop to think even long enough to see who got shot, but likely instinctively pull to neutralize the threat.”
In most places outside the US, they’d aim for legs / arms as that would “neutralize” but not “kill”. In this scenario they’ve got snipers trained on him after all, no excuses about handgun accuracy. Yet in the US, you’ll virtually never see that, all shots will be into the chest.
Re: LAPD arrests man on suspicion of making deadly swatting call to Wichita police
#826> Los Angeles police have arrested a 25-year-old man on suspicion of making the swatting call that ended with a Wichita man being killed by police. What crime are they charging him with? I don't think we have the right crime on the books for this at present. The guy who phoned this in is a scumbag, no doubt. But Andrew Finch's death is 100% on the cops who showed up. As we've seen time and time again, their selection…
> What crime are they charging him with? I don't think we have the right crime on the books for this at present.
As I read somewhere, the worst case scenario for him is murder under the rule of transferred intent, since making a false representation of this sort to the police (or other relevant authority) in Kansas is a felony.
Re: LAPD arrests man on suspicion of making deadly swatting call to Wichita police
#827What I don't understand is (or rather do understand) - I know that it is freaking hard to hit anything with a handgun even at best conditions at 25m range, with two hand hold, preparation etc. Here there people are hidden behind cars, with hand rests for steady shooting, very big range for a handgun, in a dark and suspect is blinded with torches and not even in a shooting stance. Police of all people would know that they are 99.99% safe from any shooting he may do. This is pure bullshit from police side and clear abuse of power and it must be prosecuted accordingly.
PS: swatter is also an a55hole and a criminal of course (since he admitted doing it already).
Re: LAPD arrests man on suspicion of making deadly swatting call to Wichita police
#828Earlier quoted context omitted.
Whatever. Also don't forget, then, the cost of living in the Bay Area (astronomical) and the difficulties of policing in Oakland (formidable). Pension is something we should all expect. Not resent.
Many people have difficult jobs in Oakland. Not all of them have lobbying power or unions to extract higher than market pay.
There is no universal concept of "market pay" which applies across occupations; only within a given occupation. The Oakland police are the only police available to examine in this particular "market"; there is therefore no basis for an argument about "market pay" in this context.
Re: LAPD arrests man on suspicion of making deadly swatting call to Wichita police
#829Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hate to break it to you, but America IS a macho, gun-loving, power-tripping culture. What macho, gun-loving, power-tripping game were two man-children playing that got one of them so pissed at the other that he SWATted him?
The victim was an unrelated third party.
It often is.
Re: LAPD arrests man on suspicion of making deadly swatting call to Wichita police
#830Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is what you said "Precisely why the "feared for my life" defense of police execution has to be ended." Which is a clear argument for removing officers right to defend themselves when they fear for their life, reasonably or unreasonably. You're moving the goal posts.
I think you're reading my intentions in bad faith. Of course police should be able to defend themselves when warranted . The law and training of the police has been shown to exhibit too broad a defintion of when warranted , at the expense of the citizen, because it is based on the subjective, ambiguous definition of fear . This is my last clarification of what I meant as I find this conversation is a waste of time, b…
> I think you're reading my intentions in bad faith.
One can only read your words, not your intentions. If you want to avoid miscommunication, make your words match your intentions.