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Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

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Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#811

Post by f6v »

coder-3 wrote: post #606
mattnewton wrote: post #560

Earlier quoted context omitted.

people are trying, especially for inference. For training, it’s just too high risk to tank your training I think. TPUs are at least dogfooded by Google deepmind, no team AFAIK has gotten the AMD stack to train well.

Interesting. Why? My current mental model is that AMD chips are just a bit behind, so, less efficient, but no biggie. Do labs even use CUDA?

I don’t know what’s a chicken and what’s an egg here. But ROCm support is often missing or experimental even in very basic foundational libraries. They need someone else to double down on using their chips and just break the software support out of the limbo.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#812

Post by byzantinegene »

ako wrote: post #751
nl wrote: post #685

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A Opus 4.7/Gpt5.5 class model is 5 trillion parameters[1]. To run a 8 bit quantized version of that you need roughly 5TB of RAM. Today that is around 18 NVidia B300. That's around $900,000, without including the computers to run them in. It's true that the capability of open source models is improving, but running actual frontier models on your MPB seems a way off. [1] https://x.com/elonmusk/status/204212356166685523…

Opus and Gpt are generic LLMs with knowledge on all sort of topics. For specific use cases you probably don't need all the parameters? Suppose you want to generate code with opencode, what part of the generic LLM is needed and what parts can be removed?

we're already doing that, it's called distillation and how models like deepseek are trained.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#813

Post by FartyMcFarter »

etempleton wrote: post #538
lesuorac wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? FaceBook largely requires an Apple iPhone, Apple computer, "Microsoft" computer, "Google" phone, or a "Google" computer to use it. At any point one of those companies could cut FaceBook off (ex. [1]). The Metaverse was a long term goal to get people onto a device (Occulus) that Meta controlled. While I think an AR device is much more useful than VR; I'm not convinced that it's a mistake for Meta to peruse not be…

Naming your company off a product that doesn't really exist yet and then ultimately fails is a pretty crazy and stupid thing to do. A bit cart before horse.

I think they were trying to disassociate themselves from the PR disasters Facebook was facing back then (privacy related IIRC).

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#815

Post by redsocksfan45 »

measurablefunc wrote: post #389
fsniper wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We already know that same problem has been examined by many credible mathematicians already and couldn't be solved by any of them yet. Why are we expecting AGI to one shot it? Can't we have an AGI that can fails occasionally to solve some math problem? Is the expectation of AGI to be all knowing? By the way I agree that AGI is not around the corner or I am not arguing any of the llm s are "thinking machines". It's ju…

People want to believe in magic so they will find excuses to do so. Computers have been proving theorems for a long time now but Isabelle/HOL didn't have the marketing budget of OpenAI so people didn't care. Now that Sam Altman is doing the marketing people all of a sudden care about proving theorems.

[dead]

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#816

Post by noobermin »

cheema33 wrote: post #771
cruffle_duffle wrote: post #722

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think people are looking for excuses to declare OpenAI and Anthropic teetering on the brink of failure when the actual reality is… they are wildly successful by absolutely any measure. This deal is proof. If Microsoft didn’t believe in OpenAI they wouldn’t have restructured it this way. They’d have tightened their reins and brought in “adult supervision”

> I think people are looking for excuses to declare OpenAI and Anthropic teetering on the brink of failure when the actual reality is… they are wildly successful by absolutely any measure. Maybe that will be true someday. But, right now, they are burning billions of dollars every quarter. Their expenses far far outweigh their income and they are nowhere near profitability.

silly valley stopped letting the subtraction of two numbers dictate their reality since the start-up era. while the money and vcs stopped trying to finding the next uber and went all in on llms, they didn't get wiser in how they gauge if something is worth investing in

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#817

Post by agentbc9000 »

thanhhaimai wrote: post #241

Opinions are my own. I think the biggest winner of this might be Google. Virtually all the frontier AI labs use TPU. The only one that doesn't use TPU is OpenAI due to the exclusive deal with Microsoft. Given the newly launched Gen 8 TPU this month, it's likely OpenAI will contemplate using TPU too.

Dont forget Elon, i am sure this news will come up on the up and coming OpenAI vs Elon Musk trail starting soon! I cant wait to hear all the discovery from this trail

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#818

Post by whywhywhywhy »

_vertigo wrote: post #723
nl wrote: post #679

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is somewhat out of date (Dec 2024), but gives you some idea of how far behind AMD was then: https://newsletter.semianalysis.com/p/mi300x-vs-h100-vs-h200... Pull quotes: AMD’s software experience is riddled with bugs rendering out of the box training with AMD is impossible. We were hopeful that AMD could emerge as a strong competitor to NVIDIA in training workloads, but, as of today, this is unfortunately not the…

That’s insane. There should be a big team of people at AMD whose whole job is just to dogfood their stuff for training like this. Speaking of which, Amazon is in the same boat, I’m constantly surprised that Amazon is not treating improving Inferentia/Trainium software as an uber-priority. (I work at Amazon)

I mean the fact there isn’t even today may speak to why AMD isn’t the contender it should be by this point.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#819

Post by Jtarii »

TheFirstNubian wrote: post #564
lazide wrote: post #553

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Subconsciously?!?

Lol! Wrong choice of word, maybe. I meant to say that we don’t seem to be putting much thought into how we’re outsourcing thinking to the LLMs.

The rate of improvement has given us no time to think at all. The past 3 years of progress should have been spread over the next 30 years to even give us a chance.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#820

Post by ethbr1 »

jimbokun wrote: post #506
ethbr1 wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apples and limes. The context of this thread isn't consumer chips, but Apple's analog to an H/B200.

Well Apple is in the consumer computing business.

* Powered by in-house models they've tried to train and in-house M-series inference servers
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