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macOS Big Sur

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Re: macOS Big Sur

#811

Post by DavidSJ »

jkelleyrtp wrote: post #18

Just want to put here that if you're using a Mac and haven't tried Safari recently, you're missing out. A few things: - Battery life is fantastic compared to Chrome/FF - Privacy seems to be top-notch - The tab ordering situation is now chrome-like (my biggest gripe in older versions of safari) - Experimental features are 1 click away, easily enable/disable WebGL2 - Support for the WebExtensions standard means addons…

Native support for keychain + fingerprint

Not sure if they fixed this in Big Sur, but since Mavericks all the way through Catalina there's been a critical bug with Safari's use of the macOS keychain, such that if you don't use iCloud Keychain, then you cannot migrate your Local Items keychain (the one used by Safari) to another machine, even during a restore from a backup. Hence a loss, damage, or theft of your machine means the loss of all passwords saved by Safari.

I posted about it here recently: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24626562

I switched to Firefox for this reason. I can't afford to lose all my passwords.

Re: macOS Big Sur

#812

Post by girvo »

ultrarunner wrote: post #187
thiht wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - Actually decent dev tools (used to be terrible) As a daily user of Safari, I can't let you say that. The devtools suck. The network tools suck (why is it so hard to find the request payload??), the elements tools suck, there are basically no extensions (React, Redux, etc.). They are just horrible. As much as I try to use only Safari, I still fallback on Firefox Dev when I need some real devtools. I use it for the…

Yeah, the devtools have come a long way but there's still some friction there. At this point it might just be because I'm used to Chrome's and I just need a little exercise in mental plasticity. However, eventually I'd like to take a look at porting Vue devtools to Safari, if only for iOS. Maybe I'm just old enough to remember the bad old days, but browser bugs seem very few and far between. One I've found is Chrome'…

The browser bugs/differences I run into these days aren’t surprising; they live at the edges with features that aren’t 100% complete usually, and I know that going in. Long gone are the days of surprising cross browser bugs, I’ve found

Re: macOS Big Sur

#813

Post by DevKoala »

greggman3 wrote: post #658
DevKoala wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Safari is my favorite browser. It is only missing some sort of containers or personas functionality. Those features are really good in Chrome/Firefox.

yes but of course it only runs on apple devices. I use all OSes so I prefer a browser that syncs across all of them

I get that. I stick to the Apple ecosystem and it all just works. I often think about building a Windows machine for games, but quickly lose interest.

Re: macOS Big Sur

#814

Post by higerordermap »

Razengan wrote: post #652
wayneftw wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A huge step forward into Apple’s prison complex maybe. I’ll wait to use ARM on a desktop computer until an OS/platform with more freedom and a much better UI commonly runs on ARM. That will be Windows.

> That will be Windows. The only operating system left that you still have to pay for and get third-party ads anyway, with ""telemetry"" you cannot permanently disable and an inconsistent Escheresque nightmare of a UI.

> that you still have to pay for

You think you don't pay for mac OS?

> get third-party ads anyway

Not getting any? On start bar? It can simply be resized to hide ads.

> an inconsistent Escheresque nightmare of a UI.

Some FUD spread by apple fans. Windows, GTK, and QT are all pretty good. There may be small problems but the look and feel of UI is not why I buy a computer.

Re: macOS Big Sur

#815

Post by SAI_Peregrinus »

ssvss wrote: post #635
SAI_Peregrinus wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tabs store context (history, cookies, container, etc, with tree-style tabs also parent & child tab relations) that bookmarks don't. I'm not sure about Safari (since I don't use a Mac) but on Firefox you can set up tab discarding (via extension) that unloads unused tabs. So there's a lot less incentive to use bookmarks when you can just leave a tab open forever. Really the only reason to use bookmarks instead of tabs…

>Firefox you can set up tab discarding (via extension) that unloads unused tabs What Add-on do you use for this.

Auto Tab Discard[1] does it automatically after a time. Tabs can be set to not get discarded, eg when form elements with changes are present, media is playing, tab is pinned, or just whitelisting.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/auto-tab-disc...

Re: macOS Big Sur

#816

Post by SAI_Peregrinus »

ideologysec wrote: post #798
SAI_Peregrinus wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tabs store context (history, cookies, container, etc, with tree-style tabs also parent & child tab relations) that bookmarks don't. I'm not sure about Safari (since I don't use a Mac) but on Firefox you can set up tab discarding (via extension) that unloads unused tabs. So there's a lot less incentive to use bookmarks when you can just leave a tab open forever. Really the only reason to use bookmarks instead of tabs…

Even then, you can sync open tabs with Firefox Sync! (Or Chrome sync, or Safari via iCloud)

Yes, though I find I want far fewer tabs on Mobile than I do on Desktop.

Re: macOS Big Sur

#817

Post by freediver »

amativos wrote: post #137
jkelleyrtp wrote: post #18

Just want to put here that if you're using a Mac and haven't tried Safari recently, you're missing out. A few things: - Battery life is fantastic compared to Chrome/FF - Privacy seems to be top-notch - The tab ordering situation is now chrome-like (my biggest gripe in older versions of safari) - Experimental features are 1 click away, easily enable/disable WebGL2 - Support for the WebExtensions standard means addons…

A few things that kept me from using Safari full time (instead of Chrome) last time I tried it: - On my 15" Macbook Pro (mid 2014), when you speed up videos in Safari the sound is distorted and weird, while in Chrome it sounds properly sped up. I use this a lot when watching educational videos. - Youtube videos max out at 1080p. - While there are decent ad blocking extensions, they're not as good as uBlock Origin. -…

Luckily there is a Webkit-based macOS browser that runs uBlock Origin.

Re: macOS Big Sur

#818

Post by pjmlp »

rickg17 wrote: post #809
erklik wrote: post #668

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How the hell is it "extremely inaccessible" for "most" people? Because most people don't own Macs. The last Windows compatible version of Safari was back in 2012 or so, and as far as I know, it was never available on Linux. Therefore, for me to test on Safari, I either have to spend thousands to buy a laptop, or pay out of my pocket for some sort of cross-browser testing tool (even if it's free, I am spending extra…

"Therefore, for me to test on Safari, I either have to... pay out of my pocket for some sort of cross-browser testing tool (even if it's free, I am spending extra time)" That's precisely the 'lazy web developer' that they're talking about. Oh god no, you have to test on a browser you don't use. Sure Chrome is dominant, but Safari has about 15% of the market so by taking the stance you do, you're dismissing 1 of 6 peo…

That 15% of the market is only relevant for companies targeting first world countries with people having wages to buy Apple stuff.

The large majority of the companies across the globe have already enough to do with their local markets with zero (0%) presence of Apple devices.

If Apple wants them to care about Safari, they can easily make Safari available in other platforms, has they have done when they were struggling for survival.

Re: macOS Big Sur

#819

Post by intellix »

thiht wrote: post #166
jkelleyrtp wrote: post #18

Just want to put here that if you're using a Mac and haven't tried Safari recently, you're missing out. A few things: - Battery life is fantastic compared to Chrome/FF - Privacy seems to be top-notch - The tab ordering situation is now chrome-like (my biggest gripe in older versions of safari) - Experimental features are 1 click away, easily enable/disable WebGL2 - Support for the WebExtensions standard means addons…

> - Actually decent dev tools (used to be terrible) As a daily user of Safari, I can't let you say that. The devtools suck. The network tools suck (why is it so hard to find the request payload??), the elements tools suck, there are basically no extensions (React, Redux, etc.). They are just horrible. As much as I try to use only Safari, I still fallback on Firefox Dev when I need some real devtools. I use it for the…

yep, Safari is absolutely unusable for development. Opening DevTools from an iOS open tab crashes instantly for me and it's impossible to use. It's the biggest pile of and I hope one day that Apple just discontinue it cause they obviously aren't putting any effort into it.

If you use Safari I hate you

Re: macOS Big Sur

#820

Post by natannikolic »

dntrkv wrote: post #265
enriquto wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just lost a few hundred Tabs from last session This is horrifying! How do you get to have one hundred tabs, or worse, a few hundred ?

People need to learn to let go and just close tabs. It's freeing. If you need the info again, typing some related words into the address bar will usually surface the results from your history. If it doesn't, no big deal. The benefits of not lugging around that baggage outweighs the potentially tiny productivity hit you take to look up the info again.

I agree that hoarding tabs is a bad practice that is hindering your productivity by slowing down your computer and causing distractions.

However it's definitely not true that it's easy to find things again after closing them. Search engines are terrible solution for trying to find a specific thing with broad categorical terms. All you will get are referral and affiliate websites that most definitely don't contain the most accurate, trustworthy, or up-to-date information.

I think at the moment, best information is discovered through recommendations of other people via twitter, slack, whatsapp groups, etc. But resurfacing that info later on is hard, so you need to act immediately.

My point is, when people find obscure things that will/might come handy soon or later, they tend to keep them open in the browser as a way of temporary storing them. First, because native bookmarks are a terrible solution where you quickly run out of space and keeping them organised is too much work. Second, because keeping them open serves as a visual reminder to get back to it (once bookmarked they are out of sight, out of mind).

This is precisely the reason why we developed Tablerone. It's an Chrome extension that serves as a bookmarking system (saving and organising entire sessions) and as a tab manager (easier navigation). https://tabler.one/

By having an easily accessible and private space to store information you are still processing or intend to return later liberates you of the need to keep them open. As a result you get a concise timeline overview of your browsing history, that makes it much easier to later search through with broad categorical terms.

I'm very eager to hear what you think about this.

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