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Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

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Re: Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

#811

Post by jwatte »

GFischer wrote: post #578
djsumdog wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My kick-out questions: "Could you write out what an HTTP request and response looks like on the board?" I'm really surprised at how many people can't do this. If you've spent five years developing web, surely you've had to look at raw requests, either debugging using netcat or with wireshark or just looking at the information in the Chrome/Firefox debugger? "What's the difference between a GET and a POST request?" "W…

I believe 90% of my coworkers and former coworkers would be unable to answer the HTTP response question. And 95% haven't used netcat or wireshark. I wouldn't have either, if it wasn't for some particular work related to messaging. They're able to develop reasonable line of business websites in spite of that. I would be extremely worried if they were unable to answer about the difference between GET or POST, or the di…

There is some truth to the saying that some people don't have ten years experience, they have two years of experience five times in a row.

Learning to use wireshark or tcpdump is a power tool that does show whether you got more experience in understanding the lower levels, or stayed at requirements-and-tests. (Not necessarily bad, but a good "fork" to jump off from)

Re: Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

#812

Post by BickNowstrom »

This entire blog post does not cast the author in a favourable light.

First off: It is rude to post the questions and expected answers, perhaps moreso when you just failed to pass the test yourself. That reeks of sabotage out of spite.

Then pulls the argument from authority, aggrandizing his accomplishments in an effort to salvage some of his obviously bruised ego.

> Is Google raising the bar too high or is their recruiting staff seriously lacking the skills they are supposed to rate?

Seems like Google raised the bar just high enough to weed out the unpleasant personalities. A job interview, even a phone screening, is not all about technical skill, it is also about soft skills: Is this person a pleasant and communicative person?

> Recruiter: wrong, it's file metadata.

> Me: the inode is an index uniquely identifying ...

Here is where the interview (or at least, this is probably how the author remembered it) went off the rails. Arguing with the recruiter and trying to right a perceived wrong was just plain bad strategy.

From there on out it starts being argumentative, and you can see the recruiter having none of it.

> Recruiter: Quicksort has the best big-O.

Here you can clearly tell the recruiter is just fishing for "correct" answers at this point. Just tell the recruiter with the big-O is here, don't be obtuse or difficult.

> Why not let me compare my code to yours in a benchmark?

Here it turns into a code-measuring contest. Not a very bright idea. By this point in the interview I find this author's personality very grating and needlessly argumentative. He can't do anything right by now.

> We will stop here because it's obvious that you don't have the necessary skills to write or review network applications.

The recruiter seems to agree with me, but I doubt this is what was said exactly. The conclusion may be similar though.

> Maybe Google should have stated that practice is not necessary for the job.

Maybe Google does know best what is necessary for the job. Or maybe the author knows, but he is too curt in getting his views across. Not a favourable trait.

It is hard to not get salty over a failed job interview. It takes strength of character to not burn bridges and try again in the future with a more pleasant humble approach. Take it as a lesson and move on.

Re: Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

#813

Post by random42 »

kev009 wrote: post #806
ubernostrum wrote: post #791

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the same time, it's a useful filter for the candidate. Last year when I was job hunting I kept getting fizzbuz-style phone screens, even from companies who'd specifically contacted me because they knew who I was and what my skills/experience were, because they have to be sure to filter out those unqualified core committers of software they use on a daily basis. Anyway, I got asked the "write a palindrome checker"…

In the time since that Google interview, I've moved into management and have built a very high performance team recognized as such by peers and the executive team. For internal hires, I convinced people to come work for me that I had immense respect for by using casual conversation and pitching the idea and vision for a new operating systems team. I've found this is also a classy way to hire external people. I've sin…

Wow.. I would like to work for you.

Re: Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

#814

Post by timv »

chrismorgan wrote: post #131
ryandrake wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are the components that make up a color? "Well, it depends what color model you are using, which differentiates between additive and subtractive color mixing, the medium used (print, screen, etc.)... No. It's Red, Green, and Blue.

But hang on, the primary colours are red, yellow and blue! I know, they told me so in primary school.

"They told me so in primary school" is clearly anecdotal evidence. You really need a proper citation.

Like this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yu44JRTIxSQ

Re: Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

#815

Post by bostik »

clifanatic wrote: post #685
bostik wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the interviewer is always right That is an awful sentiment, and I find myself in violent disagreement with you. A good number of my enjoyable interviews have been with candidates who clearly knew more than I did, and could expand from an interesting detail to a short ex-tempore lecture on the topic. I cherish each of those. An interview where I, as an interviewer, learn something is a fine thing indeed.

> That is an awful sentiment, and I find myself in violent disagreement with you. You find yourself in violent insistence that the world is the way you wish it was, rather than the way it actually is.

In that case I am shaping the world around me.

Any company who maintains that their interviewers are always right is telegraphing that they treat their workforce as mindless cogs in a machine.

Every time I encounter a candidate who thinks differently than I do, I treat him or her as a potential source of inspiration. Occasionally I learn something, and occasionally they do.

Re: Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

#816

Post by reitanqild »

andrepd wrote: post #781
dilemma wrote: post #735

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never said anything about your integrity but you inferred from my comment just like others will do from yours. The difference is the individual you're disparaging is a real person with a reputation. You, like me, are a throw away account on a message board. You have no integrity because you have no identity.

>The difference is the individual you're disparaging is a real person with a reputation. So? If the criticism is invalid, then it's inoffensive. If it's valid, it's deserved.

False I think.

Invalid criticism posted on the Internet or spoken out loudly might very well negatively affect someones life even if they don't personally care.

Re: Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

#817

Post by iamleppert »

I've been hit up by Google recruiters many times. I'll never interview there. The last time one of their recruiters hit me up he pretended it was for a Google X company, and then pulled a bait and switch on me, sending me a bunch of form e-mails on "interview prep" and how to expect their process would take 6 weeks minimum.

No thanks. I'm not about to put myself through a 6 week interview process at 32 years old to go work for an ad company. I'm passed the point in my life where I care and need to justify myself by trying to get a big tech company job. Already done the big tech thing.

It's not all its cracked up to be.

Re: Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

#818

Post by dewiz »

fatihky wrote: post #640
dewiz wrote: post #159

if this is Pierre, I remember some controversial discussions years back. Some links: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4113514 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4109698 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8130849

I am not him, if you ask this.

I was referring to the author of the blog post. As far as I know there is just one person authoring GWAN web server.

(funny thing the site is down, maybe given the traffic brought by HN, and I assume the web server hosting the blog is GWAN :-) )

Re: Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

#819

Post by figgis »

empath75 wrote: post #790
GFischer wrote: post #578

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe 90% of my coworkers and former coworkers would be unable to answer the HTTP response question. And 95% haven't used netcat or wireshark. I wouldn't have either, if it wasn't for some particular work related to messaging. They're able to develop reasonable line of business websites in spite of that. I would be extremely worried if they were unable to answer about the difference between GET or POST, or the di…

I basically lived in Wire shark for a couple of years working for a voip company and still use stuff like curl all the time and I don't think I could walk through an http request of the top of my head.

But could you describe the general structure?

Yeah expecting many people to be able write out a complete http request from memory without a reference to look at. But the general structure of a http request is something so basic to web development that asking what the structure of a http request looks like isn't an unreasonable expectation.

Request line (method, uri), header(s), empty, body...

Re: Google's “Director of Engineering” Hiring Test

#820

Post by Terr_ »

mikeash wrote: post #668
HereBeBeasties wrote: post #610

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I often ask the web browser one and find it quite illuminating. Best answer so far started with something like "Well, there's a microswitch in the keyboard if it's a decent one, and a circuit that debounces the input - err, is it a USB keyboard or a PS/2 one? Hmmm... How long do I have to answer this question?" THAT is the guy you want to hire...

Last time I got that question, I started with nerve impulses.

Still not enough: If you wish to explain a web-request, you must first invent the universe.
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