Earlier quoted context omitted.
They generated that money.
The ads from a search engine that bought Doubleclick generated that money.
Yes, they pass a fraction down to other companies that generate traffic for them, it's a little known model.
End of Japanese community
801–810 of 820 posts
Re: End of Japanese community
#802Earlier quoted context omitted.
Does it read like a canned response? Yes. But it is not "forceful and rude" by any means and your interpretation is way over the top for what looks like two people from different cultures trying to communicate in a mutually non-native language using words on a screen. Written messages can feel cold even when it's two native English speakers communicating over email or text and it's best to assume good faith until you…
I don't think it even matters how canned it sounds.. it seems like a polite way to move the discussion to a phone call where some real communication can happen. I think that was a perfect response. Forums are not ideal for resolving conflict, especially if language barriers exist.
I was struck by some of the responses. "No I don't want to talk on a call, just read what I typed." If that's how you think then you're part of the problem.
Re: End of Japanese community
#803Earlier quoted context omitted.
The ads from a search engine that bought Doubleclick generated that money.
Yes, they pass a fraction down to other companies that generate traffic for them, it's a little known model.
No, they don't. Firefox represents essentially $0 of revenue for Google because their market share is tiny and rate of adblock usage is high.
The only reason Google gives money to Mozilla is because they don't want to get sued for monopoly.
Re: End of Japanese community
#804Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, they pass a fraction down to other companies that generate traffic for them, it's a little known model.
No, they don't. Firefox represents essentially $0 of revenue for Google because their market share is tiny and rate of adblock usage is high. The only reason Google gives money to Mozilla is because they don't want to get sued for monopoly.
Source for this conjecture?
Re: End of Japanese community
#805> Would you be interested to hop on a call with us to talk about this further? We want to make sure we trully understand what you're struggling with. That has the same vibes as a customer support helpline that has no intention to actually help.
That’s corporate for “would you like to discuss this off the record away from public view?” Especially with a non-native English speaker who may be more comfortable expressing themselves in writing asynchronously.
Absolutely. Rule #1, always leave a paper trail when talking with companies. The social contract is long broken, there is no room for "off the record".
Re: End of Japanese community
#806> Would you be interested to hop on a call with us to talk about this further? We want to make sure we trully understand what you're struggling with. That has the same vibes as a customer support helpline that has no intention to actually help.
It may be viewed that way, but it’s also useful to empathize with someone and get more detail/nuance that can’t be conveyed simply over text. Especially when someone is not happy. I usually do the same thing when the medium is text and someone is not happy. Tone conveys a lot of useful information. Even better if you can see a person and their body language. I don’t think the cynical view of the staff person’s intent…
>get more detail/nuance that can’t be conveyed simply over text. Especially when someone is not happy.
Depends on if I'm in a one party state. I believe California is. I want every interaction on record.
Re: End of Japanese community
#807I know that everyone has already given their opinions about what kinds of people are involved and their motivations, but this is really about two fallible humans, one listing grievances and another asking to open a communication channel. That's it. Anything else you read into this is going to be fraught with your own coloring based on a hundred words written in text (a notoriously difficult medium to establish emotio…
>Anything else you read into this is going to be fraught with your own coloring based on a hundred words written in text (a notoriously difficult medium to establish emotional communication over).
It's colored based on environmental and experience. And my experience suggests that there's no transparency these days nor real progress.
This kind of dismissal is the exact kind of gsaslighting that makes me Cynical. "they just want to talk". Yeah, that's all they ever want to do.
Re: End of Japanese community
#808Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Maybe "open a communication channel" is what Mozilla should have done BEFORE they turned on this thing. This right here is the crux of the matter. But it seems to be how Mozilla operates. They frequently show a lack of awareness and consideration towards their long time supporters. I doubt this particular incident will lead to any changes, but I really wish they'd do some introspection...
This is an easy mistake in large organizations. Any project often already has so many stakeholders and politics that they are incentivized to avoid adding more stakeholders to the project if they are politically capable of doing so. Unless there is some sort of blowback, this sort of thing is likely to happen again to someone, and I understand how some people may not want to be involved anymore, and I understand how…
It's really sad when seeing this incident, and then looking at the larger picture of FOSS volunteer work and seeing that there's no one to replace the old guard once they retire out. The programmers of old never seemed to realize that volunteer work is only done when you're in a position of privrledge, and less people these days have that.
Mix that with incidents like this and you basically are seeing the real time stagnation of open source contributions. You'll only contribute if you work at a top company who chooses to have staff support it.
Re: End of Japanese community
#809I know that everyone has already given their opinions about what kinds of people are involved and their motivations, but this is really about two fallible humans, one listing grievances and another asking to open a communication channel. That's it. Anything else you read into this is going to be fraught with your own coloring based on a hundred words written in text (a notoriously difficult medium to establish emotio…
This isn't about communication though, it's about community. Mozilla just introduced a bot to overtake community efforts. > another asking to open a communication channel. The other person is asking to open a private communication channel. OT, but where is this reductionism-to-rationalize-trend coming from lately?
>but where is this reductionism-to-rationalize-trend coming from lately?
It's always been in the community. I think this decade really showed that these weren't just stellmans to understand perspectives, but die hard conservatives (in the literal sense of the word) who want to maintain decorum over anything else. No matter the situation. Google can announce a hostile takeover of a government tomorrow and such folk will react "well let them talk it out. Google is a big company after all".
Re: End of Japanese community
#810Earlier quoted context omitted.
Betrayal has that effect. They're supposed to be the good side. They abandoned that, and now they're just like any other unsuccessful tech company, desperately clinging to relevance while discarding all the ideals that made some of us support them.
How would you run Firefox? How would you challenge Google and keep the web open?
It's a bit futile with the current structure. But if you really gave me the keys, I'd make sure we cut out Firefox to the properly nonprofit side of Mozilla. And then I'd probably have to fire a lot of people. Anything that isn't laser focused on improving the browser is slashed. No vpn services, no privacy services. It's a browser, with docs to maintain to keep a browser running. There's still too many problems to solve to branch out to more.
Monetization definitely isn't easy. It'd be a mix of donations, fundraising, and corporate deals that align with the mission. With a very lean team it should be sustainable, though. The goal is to become an objectively better experience than any other browser, and there's still a lot of jank to work on to achieve that.