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Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

nytimes.com

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Re: Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

#81

Post by fche »

jes wrote: post #58
DanielBMarkham wrote: post #31

I'm voting this one up although I have concerns the article could end up in some kind of partisan BS here. So let's be clear about the root of the problem: government regulations demand that public officials have recordable conversations as part of their duties. This allows openness and inspection. (It also allows political shenanigans) It's a very, very similar situation to where we are with government spying on the…

> And the proper response to a government that refuses to act in a reasonable manner is non-violent non-participation. I couldn't agree more.

Try "non-participating" by not paying taxes....

Re: Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

#82

Post by JackFr »

sanderjd wrote: post #50
JustSomeNobody wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, definitely more of the same. Until this nation's citizens stop the my party is better than your party BS and actually start paying attention to what these people are doing to our country, we'll never have change.

The "everything's terrible!" tone of your comment is one of the major problems and main contributors to the partisan divide. It would be harder to get people riled up for their pet party if more people were aware that, hey, things are going pretty well! It would make the things that aren't going as well easier to identify and work on.

Everything is terrible -- in that the two leading parties in the United States are doing a poor job of representing the values of the people. They need to be fundamentally readjusted or be replaced by better alternatives, and that is not accomplished easily.

In nerdy terms, if there are N dimensions to public policy and individuals are represented as N dimensional vectors, the ideologies of our current parties do a terrible job of dimensional reduction.

Re: Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

#83

Post by Vula_Design »

LostInTheWoods2 wrote: post #78
mootothemax wrote: post #6

Hilary Clinton's not the first nor only politician guilty of doing this, NY Daily News just put together five other notables: - Sarah Palin - Mitt Romney - Karl Rove - Andrew Cuomo - Chris Christie aide Bridget Anne Kelly http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/5-examples-lawmaker... It definitely seems less than ideal for these rules to be abused like this. The problem is, how do you stop it? It's unreasonable to e…

"The problem is, how do you stop it?" You stop it by holding people accountable for their actions. I manage to keep my work e-mail separate from my private e-mail, it's not hard.

Yes, but that is self regulation. I think the point here is that, short of having convenient Romanian hackers break into the personal accounts of high ranking officials from time to time to update us, the state and the public have no way of knowing if they are using personal accounts for some of their communication. The only way to get around this would be to actively monitor all web activity by these officials to ensure that the National Archives are fully aware of all pertinent communication through any channel. Obviously this poses serious questions about privacy for public officials, but if they take a position of public office and have been shown to be deliberately subverting the system in place to keep them accountable, then perhaps that is what's necessary?

Re: Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

#84

Post by 001sky »

untog wrote: post #72
orbifold wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well things are not going pretty well, there is still no real solution to the crash of 2008 in sight, right now we still have essentially bankrupt banks that are trading worthless assets in an artificially created market. Look at the charts in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Household_income_in_the_United_... for example, real average hourly wages are still lower than in the 1970s, gdp growth has largely decoupled from…

Well that's the core of the problem, isn't it? "Pretty well" is extremely relative. The US is recovering from the crash of 2008 better than most countries in the world. Unemployment is down and getting better, but as you say, household income is still not doing great. So what is "pretty well" in this context? Damned if I know.

So what is "pretty well" in this context? Damned if I know.

If you have acess to capital at 0% interest rates, you are doing fine.

Re: Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

#85

Post by joshuaheard »

Spooky23 wrote: post #74
mootothemax wrote: post #6

Hilary Clinton's not the first nor only politician guilty of doing this, NY Daily News just put together five other notables: - Sarah Palin - Mitt Romney - Karl Rove - Andrew Cuomo - Chris Christie aide Bridget Anne Kelly http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/5-examples-lawmaker... It definitely seems less than ideal for these rules to be abused like this. The problem is, how do you stop it? It's unreasonable to e…

I work in a .gov and have had exposure to this issue directly in a few different contexts. The advocates for full disclosure imo are biting their nose to spite their face. Normal people running everything from little leagues to major corporations use email for strategy development, information delivery, deliberative functions and other normal business processes. Known figures in government cannot do that, because the…

That's a good argument for changing the law. However, it is not a defense against Clinton breaking the current law. The President and other executive branch members can claim executive privilege which is the actual legal defense you describe.

Clinton did not claim executive privilege. She set up a secret email account in order to avoid disclosure laws. This criminal and corrupt action should disqualify her for presidential office.

Re: Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

#86

Post by beams_of_light »

mootothemax wrote: post #6

Hilary Clinton's not the first nor only politician guilty of doing this, NY Daily News just put together five other notables: - Sarah Palin - Mitt Romney - Karl Rove - Andrew Cuomo - Chris Christie aide Bridget Anne Kelly http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/5-examples-lawmaker... It definitely seems less than ideal for these rules to be abused like this. The problem is, how do you stop it? It's unreasonable to e…

You forgot nearly the entire Bush Jr. administration.

Re: Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

#87

Post by 001sky »

blfr wrote: post #17

The whole disclosure stems from hacking of another e-mail account, apparently. The disclosure that Hillary Clinton used a non-governmental e-mail address while she was Secretary of State originally came courtesy of “Guccifer,” the Romanian hacker now serving time in a Bucharest prison for his online attacks against scores of public figures. As TSG first reported in March 2013, “Guccifer” illegally accessed the AOL e-…

The story seems a bit more complicated on how it was setup.

It was unclear whom Clinton hired to set up or maintain her private email server, which the AP traced to a mysterious identity, Eric Hoteham. That name does not appear in public records databases, campaign contribution records or Internet background searches. Hoteham was listed as the customer at Clinton's $1.7 million home on Old House Lane in Chappaqua in records registering the Internet address for her email server since August 2010.

The Hoteham personality also is associated with a separate email server, presidentclinton.com, and a non-functioning website, wjcoffice.com, all linked to the same residential Internet account as Mrs. Clinton's email server. The former president's full name is William Jefferson Clinton.

In November 2012, without explanation, Clinton's private email account was reconfigured to use Google's servers as a backup in case her own personal email server failed, according to Internet records. That is significant because Clinton publicly supported Google's accusations in June 2011 that China's government had tried to break into the Google mail accounts of senior U.S. government officials. It was one of the first instances of a major American corporation openly accusing a foreign government of hacking.

Then, in July 2013, five months after she resigned as secretary of state, Clinton's private email server was reconfigured again to use a Denver-based commercial email provider, MX Logic, which is now owned by McAfee Inc., a top Internet security company.

Re: Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

#88

Post by Bedon292 »

joshstrange wrote: post #48

From what I understand she is not the first secretary of state to do this (All her predecessors did as well) and the laws that require them to keep emails and/or use provided email were passed AFTER she held the position. I'll agree it's a bad practice but can we fault her for doing that same thing as the people before her when there was no law/rule/regulation to do otherwise?

This of course should not have been the case, but does seem to be. All of her predecessors appear to have used their personal emails as well. Kerry is the first one to use an official email. She left office at the beginning of 2013, while the official policy banning personal email went into effect at the end of 2013. http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/03/03/hillary-ema...

Re: Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

#89

Post by freehunter »

ohjesusthatguy wrote: post #71
mootothemax wrote: post #6

Hilary Clinton's not the first nor only politician guilty of doing this, NY Daily News just put together five other notables: - Sarah Palin - Mitt Romney - Karl Rove - Andrew Cuomo - Chris Christie aide Bridget Anne Kelly http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/5-examples-lawmaker... It definitely seems less than ideal for these rules to be abused like this. The problem is, how do you stop it? It's unreasonable to e…

>It's unreasonable to expect all private communications to be on public record, and if you write a note to your babysitter during office hours, why should the wider world have to know about it? >It's a difficult balance. No it's not, and you know it. If you're discussing job-related matters, use your work email, not the system you had set up so that you could evade your workplace data-retention policies. Who knows; m…

In any other workplace, this would be called data leakage. This is why many companies use web filtering software to block other email providers.

Re: Using Private Email, Hillary Clinton Thwarted Record Requests

#90

Post by TillE »

joshuaheard wrote: post #85
Spooky23 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work in a .gov and have had exposure to this issue directly in a few different contexts. The advocates for full disclosure imo are biting their nose to spite their face. Normal people running everything from little leagues to major corporations use email for strategy development, information delivery, deliberative functions and other normal business processes. Known figures in government cannot do that, because the…

That's a good argument for changing the law. However, it is not a defense against Clinton breaking the current law. The President and other executive branch members can claim executive privilege which is the actual legal defense you describe. Clinton did not claim executive privilege. She set up a secret email account in order to avoid disclosure laws. This criminal and corrupt action should disqualify her for presid…

http://thehill.com/policy/technology/234487-hillarys-emails-...
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