The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany • Hacker News Board

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#81

Post by CmonDev » Tue, Aug 19, 2014, 8:15 AM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #78

enraged_camel wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Turk, I don't see the "Turkish problem" as being Germany's fault at all. These people went to Germany on a temporary basis, and decided to just not leave when the guest-worker program ended. In other words, they overstayed their welcome. Imagine inviting a guest to your house for dinner, and them liking your house a lot and deciding to just move in permanently. Are you then expected to encourage them to put thei…

>As a Turk, I don't see the "Turkish problem" as being Germany's fault at all. These people went to Germany on a temporary basis, and decided to just not leave when the guest-worker program ended. In other words, they overstayed their welcome.* Here's how it went down. First, Germany slaughtered and exterminated millions of people, invaded tons of countries, destroyed their infrastructure, commited heinous crimes, et…

"a program for bringing in workers from places they invaded and decimated" - against their will?

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#82

Post by arethuza » Tue, Aug 19, 2014, 8:23 AM UTC

sedachv wrote: post #68

arethuza wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We get a lot of daft Muslim scare stories in some parts of the press here in the UK, "sharia law" being one of the favourites - this article in the Guardian tries to point out the reality: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/12/muslim-scare-st... On closer inspection, it is clear sharia courts only have jurisdiction on civil matters and everyone must opt in to a sharia court. They only have an advisory capacity…

Why do you think it's acceptable to have a civil court based on religious principles? The idea is wrong and is the start of a slippery slope. Opting out of these courts may not be an option for women pressured by their families and communities.

As far as I know, they aren't "courts" - they have no legal power. They are just people trying to resolve disputes outside of the courts - which is actually pretty common.

I'm not trying to say that there won't be problems with these kinds of mechanisms, but if UK citizens want to get together and try and work through a dispute based on some religious principles and all parties agree then I don't think we should be trying to stop it.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#83

Post by coldtea » Tue, Aug 19, 2014, 9:04 AM UTC

CmonDev wrote: post #81

coldtea wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>As a Turk, I don't see the "Turkish problem" as being Germany's fault at all. These people went to Germany on a temporary basis, and decided to just not leave when the guest-worker program ended. In other words, they overstayed their welcome.* Here's how it went down. First, Germany slaughtered and exterminated millions of people, invaded tons of countries, destroyed their infrastructure, commited heinous crimes, et…

"a program for bringing in workers from places they invaded and decimated" - against their will?

I don't really understand this notion -- I usually get this kind of question from Americans: that if you consent to something, it makes it OK, regardless of the circumstances under which you gave your consent. I think this ideas usually comes from people playing life in "easy mode" (white, well educated, middle or upper middle class), that have never been forced to consent to humilliating or exploitative demands of the kind billions of people often have.

If I burn down your house (and kill your cousin and your Jew neighbors), and you or your kid, starving, accepts to come work for my company, and I treat you like shit on top, that doesn't make it OK in my book.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#84

Post by hcho » Tue, Aug 19, 2014, 9:21 AM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #78

enraged_camel wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Turk, I don't see the "Turkish problem" as being Germany's fault at all. These people went to Germany on a temporary basis, and decided to just not leave when the guest-worker program ended. In other words, they overstayed their welcome. Imagine inviting a guest to your house for dinner, and them liking your house a lot and deciding to just move in permanently. Are you then expected to encourage them to put thei…

>As a Turk, I don't see the "Turkish problem" as being Germany's fault at all. These people went to Germany on a temporary basis, and decided to just not leave when the guest-worker program ended. In other words, they overstayed their welcome.* Here's how it went down. First, Germany slaughtered and exterminated millions of people, invaded tons of countries, destroyed their infrastructure, commited heinous crimes, et…

Well, Germany never invaded Turkey. If anything, they were way too cosy during WW2.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#85

Post by emsy » Tue, Aug 19, 2014, 9:41 AM UTC

trentmb wrote: post #40

emsy wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd say it's possible. I had colleagues with no grasp of the German language, minor English skills and no degree because the IT Industry in Germany is terribly hungry for employees. This was in Stuttgart (southwest), but I assume it's the same accross the country.

Sorry for the dumb question, but how would I find these employers? I did study four years of German in highschool (so I can hold a conversation with a toddler. Maybe) and have a degree in mathematics from UIUC.

If you know someone who's already working in Germany or you're able to hook up with someone, it shouldn't take long to connect you with companies that are looking for employees. You don't need to write applications in German, since most people in Germany with higher education are able and willing to communicate in English. Existing German knowledge and willingnes to pick up the language are of course an advantage. Another way to find work is to look for German companies operating in the US and trying to get in touch with someone who works there. For example, my previous employer operated at construction sites in India which helped some of my collegues to get in touch with them. If you already know in which sector you want to work, you can find companies and apply unsolicited or search their websites for job offerings. Job ads on German websites are typically placed under the keywords: Karriere, Stellenangebote, Unternehmen, Karriere, Jobs. If you have any questions feel free to ask.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#86

Post by mobiplayer » Tue, Aug 19, 2014, 12:57 PM UTC

Apocryphon wrote: post #57

mobiplayer wrote: post #4

I don't have much information about Germany apart from a couple one-week holidays, so I can't really comment on those. On the other hand, I've moved to Britain 2 years ago (with a secured job that I'm just leaving for a new one this week) and in my experience this isn't far away from "The Land of Opportunity". The Greater London area and, to some extent, the M4 corridor is just the paradise for skilled IT workers. He…

Isn't the London real estate market as pricy as S.F., though?

Yes, it is. Hence my comments about the M4 corridor as well... Worth checking it out (surely not as cheap as Berlin though).

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#87

Post by DasIch » Tue, Aug 19, 2014, 2:16 PM UTC

facepalm wrote: post #43

DasIch wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rent prices have definitely exploded and there are no signs that the upwards trend will stop anytime soon. Nevertheless they are still low compared to cities like London or Paris. Furthermore software developers in Berlin are in very high demand. If you speak English fluently and are a good software developer, getting a job in Berlin should be no problem.

Software developers are in demand, but the pay is not that great compared to other places (like Munich of Frankfurt). I think the influx of young developers from all over the world might have something to do with that. Also the lack of big companies, so it's mostly startups with limited money supply who employ developers.

The influx of developers has almost nothing to do with that. Wages in Berlin are in general somewhat lower than in Munich because Berlin is cheaper to live in.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#88

Post by CmonDev » Tue, Aug 19, 2014, 3:43 PM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #83

CmonDev wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"a program for bringing in workers from places they invaded and decimated" - against their will?

I don't really understand this notion -- I usually get this kind of question from Americans: that if you consent to something, it makes it OK, regardless of the circumstances under which you gave your consent. I think this ideas usually comes from people playing life in "easy mode" (white, well educated, middle or upper middle class), that have never been forced to consent to humilliating or exploitative demands of t…

Maybe my knowledge of history in this area is not sufficient.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#89

Post by josephschmoe » Tue, Aug 19, 2014, 5:56 PM UTC

DevoAKA wrote: post #70

guyzero wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody from Canada or Mexico would say they are "an American." Americans are residents/citizens of the USA.

Not totally true. I went to school with a lot of Mexicans and they would get verbally upset when I referred to the US as "America". As a Canadian, I could care less but they were very adamant about it.

I feel bad for people from Tijuana, as they are Californian and American but reside in neither California nor America.

The titles come from culturally distinct regions.

Re: The new land of opportunity for immigrants is Germany

#90

Post by facepalm » Tue, Aug 19, 2014, 8:08 PM UTC

DasIch wrote: post #87

facepalm wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Software developers are in demand, but the pay is not that great compared to other places (like Munich of Frankfurt). I think the influx of young developers from all over the world might have something to do with that. Also the lack of big companies, so it's mostly startups with limited money supply who employ developers.

The influx of developers has almost nothing to do with that. Wages in Berlin are in general somewhat lower than in Munich because Berlin is cheaper to live in.

Hm, does that really make sense? The level of rents should have no bearing on how much a developer is worth to a company? So it would mean the Berlin developers are just bad at negotiation?