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European Parliament passes net neutrality law

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81–90 of 152 posts

Re: European Parliament passes net neutrality law

#81
If we didn't already have such a shoddy history with national telecoms (and other infrastructure company), I would be in favor of them.

It's so unsatisfying to think that this ugly government in bed with big oligopolies, regulators, lobbying and nonsense could be the optimal solution. yuck.

Re: European Parliament passes net neutrality law

#82

Here's a kind of sickening statement: '"Europe's telecoms operators are facing decreasing revenues ... compared with operators in the U.S. and Asia," said the GSM Association, an industry group for mobile phone companies. In a statement signed by director Anne Bouverot, the group said European laws are "impairing their ability to invest in the infrastructure required to put Europe back on the path to growth and jobs.…

TeliaSonera: 1.69 billion euros in profit out of a 2.99 billion euro revenue (2013) I'm having trouble believing those numbers. I found a source that agrees with you [1] but Bloomberg charts show only a ~10% profit margin. [2] I wonder if the reporter in [1] confused annual revenue with quarterly revenue from this Bloomberg article. [3] EDIT: The reporter in [1] isn't wrong, but people misreading the first paragraph…

You're right, I was fooled by that first article's sneaky mixing of quarterly and annual numbers in the same sentence.

"The group's annual net profit fell by 25 percent to 14.97 billion kronor (1.69 billion euros, $2.3 billion), while revenue dropped by three percent to 26.5 billion kronor."

Still, these look like healthy numbers, and not like they are bleeding.

Re: European Parliament passes net neutrality law

#83

I think the EU is getting an amazing amount of work done, if you consider that it consists of 28 nation states which went to war with each other regularly for centuries up to a couple of decades ago...

The EU has only existed for a couple of decades. To suggest that the EU is a reason we haven't had any wars recently is ridiculous, yet it gets trotted out time and time again by pro europeans. It's as scientific as saying vaccinations probably cause autism. Also, the EU is not getting much useful done considering the millions that pour into it daily. The level of waste and bureaucracy is staggering. Moving the entir…

>The amount of money wasted in translating every document into every language alone is idiotic.

Because fuck those people who don't speak a certain language, amirite?

As someone from the US, some nanny-statism I dislike aside, I am very, very jealous of what the EU's getting done. They don't let corporations walk all over them, possible waste and bureaucracy issues aside.

Re: European Parliament passes net neutrality law

#84
I think this can also be taken as good news in the US. Passing these laws makes Europe a very attractive place to put an internet service.

It may be wishful thinking, but my hope is that this form of international competition motivates US legislators to pass similar net-neutrality laws to keep from losing start-ups and tech companies to Europe.

Re: European Parliament passes net neutrality law

#85

I think the EU is getting an amazing amount of work done, if you consider that it consists of 28 nation states which went to war with each other regularly for centuries up to a couple of decades ago...

The EU has only existed for a couple of decades. To suggest that the EU is a reason we haven't had any wars recently is ridiculous, yet it gets trotted out time and time again by pro europeans. It's as scientific as saying vaccinations probably cause autism. Also, the EU is not getting much useful done considering the millions that pour into it daily. The level of waste and bureaucracy is staggering. Moving the entir…

> The EU has only existed for a couple of decades. To suggest that the EU is a reason we haven't had any wars recently is ridiculous.

You don't go to war with your major trading partners, it would be economic suicide. Of course, the EU isn't the only reason why there hasn't been (more) war, but it's a significant contributing factor along with organisations like NATO.

>From regulations on fruit

Ugh. I wish people would stop bringing this horrendous straw-man up. Those regulations replaced a dozen separate national regulations with one single European regulation. That's good for trade and good for consumers. It's not something to bitch about.

>Thankfully the UK will not be part of the EU for too much longer.

You may be waiting a lot longer than you think.

Re: European Parliament passes net neutrality law

#86
A couple of popular acts emanating from the EU parliament just recently.

Couldn't be anything to do with the European parliament elections coming up this summer could it?

Our local MEP was on radio claiming credit for the smartphone recharger harmonization measure just recently. When queried about loopholes in the act that effectively allow manufacturers to sidestep the issue she revealed herself to be clueless.

Re: European Parliament passes net neutrality law

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU was born out of the EC, which was born out of the EEC, which was born out of ECSC (European Coal and Steel Community). The entire concept of the EU is that a straightforward homogenous marketplace engenders trade which in turn engenders peace, as attacking your trading partners is rarely a beneficial move. Nuclear weapons and MAD were extant before the EEC and throughout its existence, and have not played a ro…

Come on, that's a silly thing to say, everyone's empires were significantly dismantled after WW2. It's easy not to fight when there's nothing to fight over and you've got a massive bear beating at the door. I'm not claiming the EU's done nothing, I think it's made Europe richer, increased growth, etc., I'm claiming the EU had nothing to do with peace in Europe. Europe would still be at peace today with or without a c…

> there's literally been no reason to fight.

But how does that differ to WWII? Sure, reparations, polish corridor (not a reason at all), rise of fascism - but those things happened in a Europe that had sworn it would never fight again at Versailles. LN failed impressively because it was oriented around arms control and security pacts, rather than trade agreements - it attempted to treat the symptoms, not the cause. NATO isn't dissimilar, but functions as the economic end of things is looked after by the EU.

Fundamentally, it's hard to either prove or disprove, as the only reference points we have are other similar historical contexts, but my money is on trade being a great enabler. Worked for the Romans, until they switched to military dominance (because they ended up with a plutarchy due to the traders (senators) getting richer, who ended up with private armies), at which point it all fell apart. Again, many other factors, and all of history is a great big murk from which we have to try to model what happens today.

Re: European Parliament passes net neutrality law

#88
post #72
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure that higher prices for international calls have not been abolished, though, which puts a dent in the idea of shopping around for the best deal. Though, I suppose you could buy multiple SIMs and switch them around as needed now.

To my understanding calls from your own country to another EU country are also covered by this: http://ec.europa.eu/news/science/130916_en.htm The quote: >International call charges would be capped at the price of a long-distance domestic call and intra-EU mobile calls at €0.19 per minute (plus VAT).

Ah, I'm glad to be proven wrong on this one!

Still, it's a cap not a complete abolishment so there's still some work to be done.

Re: European Parliament passes net neutrality law

#89

Here's a kind of sickening statement: '"Europe's telecoms operators are facing decreasing revenues ... compared with operators in the U.S. and Asia," said the GSM Association, an industry group for mobile phone companies. In a statement signed by director Anne Bouverot, the group said European laws are "impairing their ability to invest in the infrastructure required to put Europe back on the path to growth and jobs.…

TeliaSonera: 1.69 billion euros in profit out of a 2.99 billion euro revenue (2013) I'm having trouble believing those numbers. I found a source that agrees with you [1] but Bloomberg charts show only a ~10% profit margin. [2] I wonder if the reporter in [1] confused annual revenue with quarterly revenue from this Bloomberg article. [3] EDIT: The reporter in [1] isn't wrong, but people misreading the first paragraph…

Thank you very much for that breakdown!

Re: European Parliament passes net neutrality law

#90

I wouldn't give too much on this just yet. From the information in the article I can't tell if the word "strong" is correct for what was passed today. If anything, an indicator that Neelie Kroes is happy with the result might point to a weak law that won't help net neutrality at all. We might not have the "Specialised services" part in there anymore. Yet, let's wait until the dust settles and some people have read th…

Would you elaborate on your final paragraph, please? I wasn't aware of either a closed-door US-EU trade agreement in the works, or any back room ACTA-style deal in a Canada-EU treaty.
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