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I Hope My Father Dies Soon

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Re: I Hope My Father Dies Soon

#81

Post by jamie_ca »

GalacticDomin8r wrote: post #41
vezzy-fnord wrote: post #26

Since this concerns the U.S. government, I'll say that the vendetta against euthanasia and doctor-assisted suicide by the Christian right is puzzling. The Bible has a very ambivalent view on suicide (as with any other topic), the tale of Samson being a prime example. The main argument against suicide comes from Corinthians, but it is starkly contradicted by other passages. A person who is slowly succumbing, immobile,…

The bible doesn't condemn suicide(or abortion) anywhere in it directly. However, as with any good moral book, it is ambiguous. You can use it advocate any position you chose. > Yet the Christian right insists that the agony be prolonged to a maximum. Christianity didn't always hold this view. I suppose some of the movement comes from the commandment "Thou shall not kill". Of course that is a very poor translation. A…

The one I've heard as being somewhat more accurate is "Thou shalt not murder."

That is, pre-meditated and with intent. The current version could wind up damning you for self-defence.

Re: I Hope My Father Dies Soon

#82

Post by mgkimsal »

VLM wrote: post #74
droithomme wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I looked for that also and there was no mention. There's no doubt that if that was actually his father's expressed wish he would have featured that prominently in his article. What he does state is: > I'd like to proactively end his suffering and let him go out with some dignity. But my government says I can't make that decision. Neither can his doctors. He also points out early in the article that there are financia…

"He also points out early in the article that there are financial considerations: > His smallish estate pays about $8,000 per month to keep him in this state of perpetual suffering." Now you understand the reason for opposition to euthanasia. The purpose of government is to keep the rich, rich, and the poor, poor. Emptying his estate into the medical industrial complex is not an incidental side effect, but the sole p…

Pet health insurance does exist, just isn't widespread.

re: "medical industrial complex"

Right now, some arguments against euthanasia center on the heirs bumping someone off early to keep their estate. We rarely hear the opposite view which you so cynically bring up - it's in the financial interest of many megacompanies that we continue the practice of prolonging life at all costs.

Re: I Hope My Father Dies Soon

#83

Post by gcr »

GalacticDomin8r wrote: post #41
vezzy-fnord wrote: post #26

Since this concerns the U.S. government, I'll say that the vendetta against euthanasia and doctor-assisted suicide by the Christian right is puzzling. The Bible has a very ambivalent view on suicide (as with any other topic), the tale of Samson being a prime example. The main argument against suicide comes from Corinthians, but it is starkly contradicted by other passages. A person who is slowly succumbing, immobile,…

The bible doesn't condemn suicide(or abortion) anywhere in it directly. However, as with any good moral book, it is ambiguous. You can use it advocate any position you chose. > Yet the Christian right insists that the agony be prolonged to a maximum. Christianity didn't always hold this view. I suppose some of the movement comes from the commandment "Thou shall not kill". Of course that is a very poor translation. A…

I sort of don't understand the thought of turning "Thou shall not kill" into "Thou shall do everything in thine power to keep the person alive"

Re: I Hope My Father Dies Soon

#84

Post by spacecowboy »

So sorry to hear about the current situation, found myself filled with a lot of emotion as I read through it. Reminds me of a talk I had with a good friend of mine where we basically acknowledged that we're not afraid to die but that we're more afraid of the dying process.

Re: I Hope My Father Dies Soon

#85

Post by bulte-rs »

marquis wrote: post #7
a8da6b0c91d wrote: post #3

Physician assisted suicide is a super slippery slope. I'm stunned when thinking people advocate.

It works very well in countries such as the Netherlands, I've seen that first hand in cancer cases. It is the most dignified thing to do for a thinking person. Do you have examples where a large percentage of the cases are obvious malpractice? I have long planned that I will do everything in my power not to stay on life support, and recommend you do the same for the sake of your family and your sanity.

It's actually regulated quite well here in te Netherlands. Strict protocols to follow by at least two "independant" doctors. Doesn't mean stuff never goes "awry" though.

Re: I Hope My Father Dies Soon

#86

Post by altero »

Follow the money

Today patient has to pay lot of money to be kept alive. Also deciding about death is expensive and this burden would be on government.

In a few decades elderly people will be 40% of population. Government will probably have to pay bills for most of them. Only then will this become norm, but in really hideous way.

Re: I Hope My Father Dies Soon

#87

Post by IanDrake »

Reminds me of a good C.S. Lewis quote:

Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

Re: I Hope My Father Dies Soon

#88

Post by Xdes »

VLM wrote: post #74
droithomme wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I looked for that also and there was no mention. There's no doubt that if that was actually his father's expressed wish he would have featured that prominently in his article. What he does state is: > I'd like to proactively end his suffering and let him go out with some dignity. But my government says I can't make that decision. Neither can his doctors. He also points out early in the article that there are financia…

"He also points out early in the article that there are financial considerations: > His smallish estate pays about $8,000 per month to keep him in this state of perpetual suffering." Now you understand the reason for opposition to euthanasia. The purpose of government is to keep the rich, rich, and the poor, poor. Emptying his estate into the medical industrial complex is not an incidental side effect, but the sole p…

That's quite a conspiracy you have there.

Re: I Hope My Father Dies Soon

#90

Post by jl6 »

I don't wish to minimise his situation but it seems like he considers his father's suffering not quite as bad as his own suffering were he just to do the killing himself and take the jail sentence.
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