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Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

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Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#81
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Seriously? How about buying a house? Buying a car? Going to college? Going on vacation? ... In all those cases, saving USD as dollars is generally a suboptimal idea (unless its over a particularly short term, but that gets back to the short-term liquidity, not long-term investment, case.) Using the dollars to buy investments that are expected to be worth more when converted back to cash is what you usually want to…

That's a fine idea, but few people will do that in practice because they don't want any risk at all in losing the money they're saving for those things. People generally invest for the very long-term, like retirement, not for things like house downpayments.

Virtually everyone already does that in practice.

Consider the humble savings account. Those accounts may be dollar-denominated, but under the hood they're really a type of security. You're making a loan to the bank at interest - a special kind of loan that you can call at any time, in part or in full, but a loan all the same. The bank then takes that money and loans it out at interest to people who want to borrow money to buy houses cars, whatever.

There is risk involved - the people at the end of the chain might default on their loans, in which case the bank loses their money. Historically, if the bank lost enough money then they wouldn't be able to pay back the money they borrowed from you, in which case you also lose it. Nowadays banks are required to carry deposit insurance, so instead when the bank defaults the FDIC loses their money, but you still get paid. But if enough banks default then the FDIC also won't be able to make good on their guarantee to you, and you're still out your money. Meaning that when you stick your cash in a savings account, it's not really money anymore. It's an IOU - a promise to give you money when you ask for it. Probably.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#82
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Totally agreed -- they pretend to support the platform for the hipster cred & expanded market, but I'm sure the corporate policy is "Bitcoin arrives. Bitcoin is immediately placed on exchange". I'd be surprised if corporations would gamble so dangerously by keeping a Bitcoin store. As long as they price against USD and convert immediately, they can only suffer limited losses from price swings.

Unrelated: I've greatly enjoyed your comment history--particularly the bicycle metaphor and the moral stance on Bitcoin.

ahaha thanks bud!! it's been exhausting because they have so many buzzwords designed to handle counter-arguments, so many people with money invested, and well -- the fact is people are willing to pay for them. What I've been learning is that people will radically alter their lifestyle/views/demeanor when presented with the possibility for a cashout. They kinda get tunnelvision. Plus, there happen to some idealistic tech people who wouldn't mind suffering a minor loss just to see a cool idea work, so they'll keep playing with it even if they lose a couple hundred bucks here and there. It makes for some intense momentum...

Hopefully you will see me posting much less about this and much more about music signal processing + machine learning apps I'm working on :P

Looking through your comments... maybe you want to join me on some anti-Bitcoin venture? I'm thinking of compiling a site providing a detailed argument of why it makes no sense just so that I don't have to keep wasting my breath lol. But I mean the truth is a lot of these arguments are freely available (especially if you check the manifestos written up by some of Bitcoin's competitors or qualified economists). I just feel bad that naive people think it's some sort of tech "investment" and if you don't write negative stuff on the threads their first comment is "Where do I get some?". I bet this is how all pyramid schemers feel at first. Like you're investing in a company, it's just that the company doesn't make anything or do anything... Then Bitcoiners try to say that the worth is in the "ingenuity of the process" or something but then its like... THIS IS AN OPEN SOURCE CRYPTO GAME FOR F__K'S SAKE

The point is... Bitcoin is an international hoax and I get bored at work! I also tend to think that HN is turning into watered-down pseudo tech and Bitcoin is the epitome of that. All these "crypto-miners" who just execute pre-compiled code or whatever... yeesh.

Fantasy adds romanticism to peoples lives, but this one will cause too many ruined fortunes.

(Side note: It seems you & I are always arguing with the same guys, lolololol.... some of these handles are all too familiar)

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#83
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I meant into Bitcoin.

"Safely" -> TSX Composite Index Drop that qualifier and we can talk Bitcoin.

I meant safely as in I won't be keeping my funds with some shoddy company that won't ever pay out, not in terms of risk/volatility. I guess securely was what I meant.

Can we talk now?

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#84
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Looking at exchange rates in this manner changes one's perspective on volatility. For example, since the beginning of this year, the price of a US dollar has declined by more than 98%, from BTC 0.074 to just over BTC 0.001, which makes the dollar look like an extremely volatile currency! Sorry, that's clearly nonsense given that the dollar wasn't similarly volatile against other currencies. Would you slam on your b…

My physics is rusty... but yeah, it can be, depending on what you choose as your reference point. I think that's the OP's point there, too :)

bitcoin theory of relativity...

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#85
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

missing from that list -- Google, Yahoo, Amazon... actual retailers with products I don't care what VC hipsters are doing, and who the hell were the Winklevii before they started hyping bitcoin?

You might have missed the news that Baidu (basically China's equivalent of Google) have started accepting Bitcoin as payment for their services. It's unlikely that Baidu is able to do that without approval (or at least guidance) from the Chinese Government. That's partly what has sent Bitcoin soaring, the theory that China views Bitcoin as a viable alternative currency to USD, and they want to dominate it before othe…

This is interesting but where you go off the rails is with the word "dominate". If it's a currency and very easily divisible (move some decimal places) why would one need to dominate it?

You Bitcoiners claim to be more than just a mound of greedy speculators yet you view everything as a hoarder/trading scenario.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#87
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Looking at exchange rates in this manner changes one's perspective on volatility. For example, since the beginning of this year, the price of a US dollar has declined by more than 98%, from BTC 0.074 to just over BTC 0.001, which makes the dollar look like an extremely volatile currency! Sorry, that's clearly nonsense given that the dollar wasn't similarly volatile against other currencies. Would you slam on your b…

My physics is rusty... but yeah, it can be, depending on what you choose as your reference point. I think that's the OP's point there, too :)

No, while velocity is relative, acceleration is absolute. An accelerometer does not need any reference point. Well, it cannot tell the difference between acceleration and gravity, but that's an other issue.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#88
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Looking at exchange rates in this manner changes one's perspective on volatility. For example, since the beginning of this year, the price of a US dollar has declined by more than 98%, from BTC 0.074 to just over BTC 0.001, which makes the dollar look like an extremely volatile currency! Sorry, that's clearly nonsense given that the dollar wasn't similarly volatile against other currencies. Would you slam on your b…

My physics is rusty... but yeah, it can be, depending on what you choose as your reference point. I think that's the OP's point there, too :)

That's actually not the case. You can tell whether you're in an accelerating frame of reference (like a car stopping) or an inertial frame of reference (like a car cruising) by the forces you feel, so they're not really co-equal.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#89
post #41
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The platform would never tank because people know roughly what it's worth. So what exactly is the worth of one ounce of gold? The current market price? Or another price? What's the difference to Bitcoin in regards to pricing?

Eh I'll be honest I'm not sure exactly how the gold standard works but I'm pretty sure it's priced individually against many currencies, whereas Bitcoin's whole pricing system is fantastical. I'm pretty sure Bitcoin just takes it's sticker price (whatever it's currently been bid upto) and then does a bunch of arbitrary currency conversions. Again, I THINK this, do not know... but i THINK if you took the amount of gol…

"I'm pretty sure it's priced individually against many currencies"

No, it is not "priced". Nobody sets an "official price" for gold. Every actor in the market who sells and buys gold is free to set his own price, via "asks" and "bids" in the market. This is what gst highlighted for you: Bitcoin functions exactly like gold, their value fluctuates freely on international and national markets via trading, and nothing else.

"if you took the amount of gold and multiplied by its USD price to arrive at some figure of how much the "gold pool" is worth gold traders would laugh their asses off at you"

Actually, no. Analysts do this all the time. Google for "gold reserves". Here is the latest data from the World Bank: http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/FI.RES.TOTL.CD

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#90
post #7

When businesses actually price products or services in a digital currency as opposed to accepting it, we'll know it has arrived and is ready to rival national currencies.

It almost goes without saying that such a transition would require the price of Bitcoin relative to a basket of other currencies to remain more stable by a couple orders of magnitude than it does today.

Also, he didn't say it had to be bitcoin.
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