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E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)

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Re: E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)

#81

Post by jlgreco »

gonnakillme wrote: post #58
PaulHoule wrote: post #36

You'll pull my E-Z pass out of my cold dead hands. This is the first piece of vehicle telematics I added when I got a new car. When I was stuck in a traffic jam at an off-ramp near Albany, I realized how I'd make it better for myself and other drivers if I got one. It's particularly good that E-Z Pass uses the same technology as most other states in the Northeast so you can drive the Mass Pike and out to Maine or the…

It even works in the midwest! I drove to upstate New York from Chicago without paying a single old-fashioned toll a few years ago.

Do they work through Illinois? I recall them having their own system for some unknown reason, but I don't know if it is compatible.

Re: E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)

#82

Post by jlgreco »

fnordfnordfnord wrote: post #80
jlgreco wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He uses ATMs in public too right? I also want to know his debit card PIN. What right does he have to privacy?

Even if he had that right, why would he want to use it?

He's probably hiding something nefarious from us. I can think of no possible other reason to desire privacy.

Re: E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)

#83

Post by forgotAgain »

blah32497 wrote: post #51
diminoten wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you against having your car tracked? You're in public, aren't you? Why do you think you have a right to privacy in public?

I think this is a perfectly legitimate question. What is the parent post genuinely concerned about? (assuming he's not hauling drugs)

What is the parent post genuinely concerned about?

For myself, nothing. I have to say I lead a rather mundane life.

My objection is not for myself, it's for others. I don't want reporters tracked. I don't want whistleblowers tracked. I don't want government employees to feel threatened they may lose their jobs because they have a private life. For those people to be safe we all have to be protected from government tracking.

Re: E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)

#84

Post by forgotAgain »

fnordfnordfnord wrote: post #66
forgotAgain wrote: post #37

I have to disagree with those who say this isn't news. It was news to me and will, I believe, be news to most others as well. The only time before this that I heard about using EZ pass for anything other than tolls was a few years ago when I read about some feasibility work on the concept of traffic flow optimization being done around Ithaca, NY. I do wonder why they haven't been used yet to track speeding violations…

>I have to disagree with those who say this isn't news. It was never kept a secret in Houston that toll-tags were used to collect data for the real-time traffic map, this system is decades old. http://traffic.houstontranstar.org/aviinfo/avi-tech.html >EZ passes are supposed to be used in one car only so it can't be lack of ability to isolate the user that's stopping it. A car may have more than one user. >For years I…

A car may have more than one user.

With traffic enforcement cameras in New York the violations are issued to the owner of the car. They don't try to identify the person who was actually driving. Because they don't identify the driver the summons doesn't count against anyone's license.

Re: E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)

#85

Post by Anechoic »

forgotAgain wrote: post #37

I have to disagree with those who say this isn't news. It was news to me and will, I believe, be news to most others as well. The only time before this that I heard about using EZ pass for anything other than tolls was a few years ago when I read about some feasibility work on the concept of traffic flow optimization being done around Ithaca, NY. I do wonder why they haven't been used yet to track speeding violations…

I do wonder why they haven't been used yet to track speeding violations.

This question was answered for me by a Maryland DOT person a few back during a tour of one of their operations center. The upshot is that the intended purpose of EZ-pass and other toll systems are for improved traffic flow, there is a lot of DOT involvement and the DOT wants to encourage folks to use them.

If those toll systems were to be used for speed enforcement, people would be discouraged from using them, which hurts the DOT's objective. Furthermore (and this is probably the bigger reason), since the DOT is deeply involved in deploying and monitoring the system, they would be subject to subpoenas by offenders challenging their speeding tickets and the DOT absolutely wants no part of that.

Re: E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)

#86

Post by alexqgb »

forgotAgain wrote: post #83
blah32497 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this is a perfectly legitimate question. What is the parent post genuinely concerned about? (assuming he's not hauling drugs)

What is the parent post genuinely concerned about? For myself, nothing. I have to say I lead a rather mundane life. My objection is not for myself, it's for others. I don't want reporters tracked. I don't want whistleblowers tracked. I don't want government employees to feel threatened they may lose their jobs because they have a private life. For those people to be safe we all have to be protected from government tr…

Sorry, accidental downvote. I meant to upvote since you nailed it: I want privacy norms to be respected not because I have anything in particular to hide, but because I want people who can advance my general interests as a citizen to be able to do so safely.

I am acutely aware that doing so demands adversarial relationships with powers that can be concentrated, lawless, and malign. The risks faced by people challenging them are real. They deserve all the protection they can get.

Put simply, we're all in this together.

Re: E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)

#87

Post by IgorPartola »

forgotAgain wrote: post #37

I have to disagree with those who say this isn't news. It was news to me and will, I believe, be news to most others as well. The only time before this that I heard about using EZ pass for anything other than tolls was a few years ago when I read about some feasibility work on the concept of traffic flow optimization being done around Ithaca, NY. I do wonder why they haven't been used yet to track speeding violations…

Speeding cameras and other ways to ticket people automatically are problematic in the US. See, in Europe, the ticket can be given to the owner of the car. The problem is simple: take a picture of the license plate, look up the owner, send ticket.

In the US, the law says that the only person that gets the ticket is the driver which != owner in a lot of cases. Because of this, places that have speeding cameras have to employ people to look at pictures of the person driving and compare them to pictures of the license of the owner, or try to identify the driver by some other means. Needless to say this is expensive. On top of that, states like North Carolina require that all or most proceeds from speeding cameras tickets go to education, and not the police department. Thus, the police department has no reason to shell out $100k/year on running a camera to see none of the profits. They'd rather hire an extra officer to give out tickets manually.

That could be different for tickets given for average speed violations, as you could give them to the driver, but that would likely create a traffic backup nightmare.

Re: E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)

#88

Post by jlgreco »

joe_bleau wrote: post #24
dsl wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't keep plates on my car because of the abundance of plate tracking applications in use by the government and private companies.

Time for a kickstarter for an e-ink license plate? Tie it to a GPS with known locations of cameras, and change your tag for each picture?

That seems like it would be a great deal more illegal than simply just not having tags.

Re: E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)

#90

Post by fnordfnordfnord »

forgotAgain wrote: post #84
fnordfnordfnord wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I have to disagree with those who say this isn't news. It was never kept a secret in Houston that toll-tags were used to collect data for the real-time traffic map, this system is decades old. http://traffic.houstontranstar.org/aviinfo/avi-tech.html >EZ passes are supposed to be used in one car only so it can't be lack of ability to isolate the user that's stopping it. A car may have more than one user. >For years I…

A car may have more than one user. With traffic enforcement cameras in New York the violations are issued to the owner of the car. They don't try to identify the person who was actually driving. Because they don't identify the driver the summons doesn't count against anyone's license.

The Texas legislature recently made the cameras illegal here, but even before that, a 'ticket' was only a civil matter. They would make a note on your credit report against you if you failed to pay.
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