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DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

washingtonpost.com

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Re: DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

#81

Post by betterunix »

rayiner wrote: post #63
grumps wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure that even if a 1st grader could sign a contract that it would be legal. I believe these are public schools, and I think they're legally required to accept students.

Contracts with minors (under 18, not just first graders) are unenforceable (technically: voidable) with very narrow exceptions. The lesson here is that schools won't do your work for you. They have zero incentive to educate you about you rights. They can tell you the law is whatever sounds convenient for them--they're gambling that people will just go along and not check.

"schools...have zero incentive to educate you"

Hm...

Re: DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

#82

Post by betterunix »

tomx wrote: post #21

What would the ideal policy be? My ideas are: - Students own their own work; even if they don't really care for it. I don't see any value in a 10 year pile of homework, but if you create a great piece of art, you should be able to take it home. Realistically, most work is valueless and binned. - Any created teaching materials may optionally be released as open source, under some license that prevents anyone profiting…

"What would the ideal policy be?"

Not applying copyrights to education and knowledge, because copyrights make no sense in an age of widespread fast Internet access. Further, as public schools are government entities, they should not have copyrights at all; all unclassified government work should be in the public domain, and schools should not even think about classifying their teachers' or students' work.

Re: DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

#83

Post by tedks »

ahoyhere wrote: post #58
[deleted] wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[deleted]

I used to live in Greenbelt, in the heart of PG County, and my 2-bedroom-and-den semi-crappy apartment cost $1750 nearly 7 years ago. And Greenbelt is a DUMP. An expensive, expensive dump. Since the apartments were all full — and not 6 people to a unit, either… -- there's only one conclusion… PG County is a lot wealthier than you think. It's not all in Bowie and "the north."

Greenbelt probably has inflated housing prices, being so close to UMD College Park.

Re: DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

#84

Post by ihsw »

homosaur wrote: post #37
ihsw wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To give plagiarism more teeth? To deter students from copying each-others notes? To reinforce a policy of students accessing knowledge from only legitimate sources (ie: textbooks)? The applications are numerous and potentially lucrative.

And how does copyright aid this? What's the school going to do, start suing kids that plagiarize?

* Sue students that are plagiarizing (copying answers)

* Sue students are assisting plagiarism (allowing others to copy answers)

* Regulate libraries as intermediaries for transmitting and publishing unlicensed content (eg: counterfeit books, unlicensed books), inadequately securing the photocopying machines, borrowed material, and other potentially infringing assets

* Sue libraries for encouraging, enabling, or facilitating infringement (ie: studying)

I foresee a future where libraries are regulated and managed in the same manner that ISPs are, perhaps even more-so due to the physical limitations and monetization of the unlicensed content available.

Re: DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

#85

Post by SeanLuke »

Anechoic wrote: post #50
Petrushka wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PG County is Maryland, not DC. It's the county that wraps around the eastern side of the District, and includes the University of Maryland. The rules of the District don't apply to what they're trying to do. I think the author mentioned them (and those of Montgomery County, PG's far wealthier and higher performing neighbor) to show that the idea wouldn't be possible in those school districts. Notably, PG County has a…

Notably, PG County has [..] a relatively low-income population Really? According to wiki, the median household income is over $71,000 and 38% of households earned over $100,000. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Georges_County,_Maryland... edit: okay, I suppose PG county is lower income than Montgomery, Arlington, Fairfax, and Loudoun counties, but the population is certainly not "low income" even for a high-cost-o…

PG County has wide variance in income. Further out in the county there are fairly well-off people. But there is a dense population of urban poor near the DC border.

Re: DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

#86

Post by doktrin »

Anechoic wrote: post #50
Petrushka wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PG County is Maryland, not DC. It's the county that wraps around the eastern side of the District, and includes the University of Maryland. The rules of the District don't apply to what they're trying to do. I think the author mentioned them (and those of Montgomery County, PG's far wealthier and higher performing neighbor) to show that the idea wouldn't be possible in those school districts. Notably, PG County has a…

Notably, PG County has [..] a relatively low-income population Really? According to wiki, the median household income is over $71,000 and 38% of households earned over $100,000. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Georges_County,_Maryland... edit: okay, I suppose PG county is lower income than Montgomery, Arlington, Fairfax, and Loudoun counties, but the population is certainly not "low income" even for a high-cost-o…

PG is a relatively large place, and county-wide statistics hide some very real poverty.

It also bears mention that, while not directly correlated, PG county has at times had a murder rate on par with Baltimore.

Re: DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

#87

Post by derleth »

tedunangst wrote: post #69
derleth wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Harassment. Making a scene, also known as disturbing the peace. Refusing to leave, which amounts to criminal trespass. Maybe even assault, if they're really feeling their oats and are willing to claim you made them fear for their safety.

If it gets to the point where a school official asks a parent to leave, my advice would be to walk away and call your favorite education lawyer. Do you really think refusing to leave is going to change their mind?

> Do you really think refusing to leave is going to change their mind?

I think you missed my point: The fact they accused you of refusing to leave does not mean you did, in fact, refuse to leave.

Re: DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

#88

Post by kevin_rubyhouse »

tedunangst wrote: post #53
DanBC wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If a school tells you that you can't do what's right by your child because "it's the law," ask for the citation of the law. If it's really a law, there is a citation, and the law can be looked up. In the United States, under its Anglo-American system of law, the default assumption is individual liberty (and parents rather than schools acting in the interests of minor children), so make sure to check the specific la…

What are they going to tell the police? "These parents won't let us copyright their children's work, please arrest them."?

More likely a notice would be issued and they would be taken to court if they refuse to comply.

Re: DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

#89

Post by dalke »

hmsimha wrote: post #57
noonespecial wrote: post #3

Wow, as a student in HS I literally wouldn't have been able to turn in certain homework due to an agreement I had signed as a contractor(1). There's an excuse for you. "No Ma'am, I don't have today's homework, I'm under nda." (1) It was a ridiculous contract, probably completely invalid because I was 17 at the time, but still... Homeschooling for business reasons?!

From what I read, it looks like the policy would apply to work produced 'for the school' or use by the school or part of the school, or with school equipment. So I suppose if you claimed all work you turned in had been produced by you prior to the assignment, for your own, or other, purposes, you (or the copyright owner) would retain your rights.

I believe that noonespecial's "ridiculous contract" was such that the other party claimed copyright ownership to all copyrightable material generated by noonespecial, including work which had no relation to the other party.

This would, therefore, include work done for school, if a transfer of copyright for schoolwork is required as part of the education.

Re: DC-area schools consider copyright policy that takes ownership of students’ work

#90

Post by nitrogen »

1wheel wrote: post #39
jiggy2011 wrote: post #6

Why would you want to own the IP for a bunch of crappy school projects?

I don't think they intended to: > Questioned about the policy after it was introduced, Jacobs said it was never the board’s “intention to declare ownership” of students’ work. “Counsel needs to restructure the language,” Jacobs said. “We want the district to get the recognition . . . not take their work.” Jacobs said last week that it was possible amendments could be made to the policy at the board’s next meeting. Th…

It's still offensive for the district to claim the right to recognition for students' work.
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