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NSF pilots 4-year PhDs with industry research placements

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Re: NSF pilots 4-year PhDs with industry research placements

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

because its good to have people not be misled by absolute statements like this "No MS lasts 3-4 years" that are simply incorrect. do you enjoy being a source of misinformation?

What percentage of all MS awarded would you wager are intended to be 3-4 years?

the verb you used was "lasts" not "intended".

Re: NSF pilots 4-year PhDs with industry research placements

#82
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

sometimes an institution will give an ms as a consolation prize for time spent not being able to finish a phd [0]. in those cases they can be upwards of 5 years, but they certainly aren't industry driven [0] often a leadership or personality failure of the PI

My program had an exam after 2 years. You could fail completely, do well enough to leave with a MS, or fully pass and continue to a PhD.

that is one way things can be structured, yes.

Re: NSF pilots 4-year PhDs with industry research placements

#83

I don't love the increasing move towards industry research instead of traditional academia. It is just going to mean more closely-held, proprietary advancements.

v.s. politicking forever, enslaving grad students and making only a passable salary? Not to mention being incentivized to lie, cheat and steal when publishing in order to maintain your position? Academia as we know it has been dead for a while, and AI is the final harbinger. The reproducibility crisis got that much worse now that the papers that nobody ever bothered to reproduce have grown 10x in number with the pres…

Yeah, academia is very 'unregulated'

Re: NSF pilots 4-year PhDs with industry research placements

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What percentage of all MS awarded would you wager are intended to be 3-4 years?

the verb you used was "lasts" not "intended".

> There’s already a 3-4 year advanced degree

What do these words mean to you? To me they imply the degree is intended to last 3-4 years. The English is very clear here.

Re: NSF pilots 4-year PhDs with industry research placements

#85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There’s already a 3-4 year advanced degree in the United States with an optional thesis component... There isn't. And if you are trying to snarkily describe an MS, then most MS programs are too short. > So why are they calling it a doctorate? I don’t see the point. It’s not like the NSF under this administration is particularly fond of STEM doctorates. The I-PhD is basically a formalization of industry-sponsored Ph…

> There isn't. My coworkers holding such degrees would beg to differ. > And if you are trying to snarkily describe an MS, then most MS programs are too short. It wasn’t snarky, it was a listing of common points between the two. I don’t see what distinguishes this from a MS. A year still isn’t enough time to write a doctoral-level thesis, so if the I-PhD is supposed to represent a “longer MS” then it’s still insuffici…

What are you referring to with "such degrees?" Just the name of the credential would be enough. The closest stuff I can think of is a JD or an MD, but otherwise there's no common graduate credential in the US that takes 3+ years full time, other than a PhD. I guess there are EdDs and PsyDs, but I've never heard of that sort of thing in engineering.

And to be pedantic, every single one of those credentials I've mentioned is a doctorate, even if it's not a PhD.

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