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Performance per dollar is getting faster and cheaper

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Re: Performance per dollar is getting faster and cheaper

#81

Post by embedding-shape »

minraws wrote: post #2

Can you folks add performance per watt as a metric to these comparisons, I honestly want to understand where AMD fits in the stack in terms of actual performance to dollars. I have had talks with companies wanting to build data centers outside of US and find it hard to source anything Nvidia in sufficient capacity and scale. If AMD is competitive performance per watt and roughly reliable in terms of software support…

> I have never seen a company use AMD outside of wafer and a couple others mostly in US.

Worth remembering AMD basically "owns" (not literally) the hardware-side of things in video games consoles for good many years now, with no end in sight.

Re: Performance per dollar is getting faster and cheaper

#82

Post by hypfer »

jml7c5 wrote: post #70
ffsm8 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The people having glass literally break from the vibrations would probably disagree with your opinion https://youtu.be/_bP80DEAbuo?is=sg09k66iutKFIFSo Yet here we are, discussing "data center" as if they're standardized and of similar (nose) isolation. There are no meaningful regulations in building them, and they can be incredibly polluting. So your experience with a potentially well isolated one is sadly not the no…

>The people having glass literally break from the vibrations would probably disagree with your opinion Can you cite a source for this? It's not in the video, as far as I can tell. I would be wary of Benn Jordan's videos. They are full of mistakes and misrepresentations, as Andy Masley has convincingly demonstrated: https://blog.andymasley.com/p/contra-benn-jordan-data-center... I recall seeing Benn Jordan's responses…

Benn unfortunately is one of those people that actually feel stuff, which is a trait that easily gets exploited by bad actors.

Indeed, he shot himself in the foot there pretty bad, but I would argue that that was just the result of successful Agitation.

I would personally strongly prefer being in the same room with Benn compared with Andy, because one of them is authentic, while the other is calculating. Though, arguably, Benn has been catching up on that lately too.

But yeah, taking stuff with a grain of salt should be the default regardless of the person speaking.

Re: Performance per dollar is getting faster and cheaper

#83

Post by heisenbit »

kingstnap wrote: post #21
minraws wrote: post #2

Can you folks add performance per watt as a metric to these comparisons, I honestly want to understand where AMD fits in the stack in terms of actual performance to dollars. I have had talks with companies wanting to build data centers outside of US and find it hard to source anything Nvidia in sufficient capacity and scale. If AMD is competitive performance per watt and roughly reliable in terms of software support…

A DGX B200 costs like ~$0.5 M and uses around 14 kW. If you plan to run it straight for 8 years 100% max usage thats around 1 GWhr. A gigawatt hour is a lot of energy but its not that much compared to the price of the actual machine. In Germany for example with its expensive energy thats about €100k worth, which spread over 8 years is pretty minor compared to the up front half mill. The real issue with high power con…

Plus the power needed for cooling adding maybe 50%.

Re: Performance per dollar is getting faster and cheaper

#84

Post by flawn »

lgessler wrote: post #55
tw1984 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

from memory, it is like 96-98% of the accuracy.

Accuracy isn't a meaningful metric here without reference to a specific task.

Additionally, I'd imagine quantization to have more side-effects than just slightly lower performance (on whatever task). You are basically removing information, and that information could be by chance what the model needs to fulfill it exactly the way you'd want to do - although it's still fully capable. I am not sure if this is really different from "lower performance" but open to hear your opinions.

Re: Performance per dollar is getting faster and cheaper

#86

Post by ekianjo »

embedding-shape wrote: post #81
minraws wrote: post #2

Can you folks add performance per watt as a metric to these comparisons, I honestly want to understand where AMD fits in the stack in terms of actual performance to dollars. I have had talks with companies wanting to build data centers outside of US and find it hard to source anything Nvidia in sufficient capacity and scale. If AMD is competitive performance per watt and roughly reliable in terms of software support…

> I have never seen a company use AMD outside of wafer and a couple others mostly in US. Worth remembering AMD basically "owns" (not literally) the hardware-side of things in video games consoles for good many years now, with no end in sight.

Because they have x86 CPU licenses.

Re: Performance per dollar is getting faster and cheaper

#87

Post by jingpostmedia »

minraws wrote: post #2

Can you folks add performance per watt as a metric to these comparisons, I honestly want to understand where AMD fits in the stack in terms of actual performance to dollars. I have had talks with companies wanting to build data centers outside of US and find it hard to source anything Nvidia in sufficient capacity and scale. If AMD is competitive performance per watt and roughly reliable in terms of software support…

[flagged]

Re: Performance per dollar is getting faster and cheaper

#88

Post by embedding-shape »

ekianjo wrote: post #86
embedding-shape wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I have never seen a company use AMD outside of wafer and a couple others mostly in US. Worth remembering AMD basically "owns" (not literally) the hardware-side of things in video games consoles for good many years now, with no end in sight.

Because they have x86 CPU licenses.

Every single video game console of the last generation (and probably further back) are using AMD Radeon for graphics too FWIW. I think the Switch might be the only outlier recently using nvidia graphics.

Re: Performance per dollar is getting faster and cheaper

#89

Post by embedding-shape »

7thpower wrote: post #56
minraws wrote: post #2

Can you folks add performance per watt as a metric to these comparisons, I honestly want to understand where AMD fits in the stack in terms of actual performance to dollars. I have had talks with companies wanting to build data centers outside of US and find it hard to source anything Nvidia in sufficient capacity and scale. If AMD is competitive performance per watt and roughly reliable in terms of software support…

Typically any company that can’t get Nvidia to fill their orders will have at least some AMD.

What type of company are you talking about here? Granted, nowadays I mostly interact with ML-adjacent companies but almost none would go "Hmm, hard to get nvidia hardware today, lets dump all expertise and knowledge of CUDA et al we have and start using AMD hardware until we can get nvidia", everyone would just wait or rent in the meantime.

Re: Performance per dollar is getting faster and cheaper

#90

Post by redsocksfan45 »

jml7c5 wrote: post #70
ffsm8 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The people having glass literally break from the vibrations would probably disagree with your opinion https://youtu.be/_bP80DEAbuo?is=sg09k66iutKFIFSo Yet here we are, discussing "data center" as if they're standardized and of similar (nose) isolation. There are no meaningful regulations in building them, and they can be incredibly polluting. So your experience with a potentially well isolated one is sadly not the no…

>The people having glass literally break from the vibrations would probably disagree with your opinion Can you cite a source for this? It's not in the video, as far as I can tell. I would be wary of Benn Jordan's videos. They are full of mistakes and misrepresentations, as Andy Masley has convincingly demonstrated: https://blog.andymasley.com/p/contra-benn-jordan-data-center... I recall seeing Benn Jordan's responses…

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