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EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

reuters.com

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Re: EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

#81

Post by NoLinkToMe »

cicko wrote: post #30
2muchtime wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is a lot of people might be right at the tipping point of buying an EV and then some news like this comes out and it pushes them over the line. I feel EVs at this moment are right at the level of “I’m gonna buy a new car, but maybe I’ll wait for the one after before I jump into an EV”. Better batteries (solid state), better charging speeds and more fast charger availability seem to have a large group of peo…

That makes no sense to me. I've had an EV for five years and right now the infrastructure is fantastic in comparison. There are chargers everywhere, they're fast enough, and the prices are reasonable. The batteries are also quite large. I see absolutely no reason to buy an IC car any more. Many people have solar panels installed, making the commute practically free.

I think at the upper range, and for Teslas, this is true. But for the rest, not quite yet.

Suppose you buy an entry-level Renault 5, the WLTP range is 310km. In mild conditions you typically get 85-90% of that, enough for the majority of people. But in winter you get 65% of that, so 195km, on a new battery. And after 5 years that may be 165km in winter, and that's just not great. With home-charging that still is enough for most requirements, but you are more restricted for longer trips and have to charge diligently.

I live in an apartment so I wouldn't be home-charging daily, there'd be plenty of times I'd want to park my car at the first available spot in my area at 55% charge and use it the next day, which is even more restrictive.

For the entry-level Tesla the WLTP range is 530km or 70% more. There the problem is much less. And for home-chargers, it's also a no-brainer usually, especially with home solar. But for an apartment-dweller who just needs an entry-level car, it's still a toss-up between a new EV like a renault 5 for 30k, or just a Toyota Corolla Hybrid that gets great mileage, low maintenance and can be had new for 30k or a few years old for 20k.

Unfortunately, I refuse to buy a Tesla due to Musk's politics.

Re: EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

#82

Post by NoLinkToMe »

bormaj wrote: post #48

Slightly off-topic, but can anyone comment on the quality of the EV charging infrastructure in the EU? Outside of owning an EV and charging it at home/work, are fast chargers reliable and abundant enough for road trips? I recently looked into renting an EV in Spain and instead opted for gas. It seems like the public charging infrastructure is just not all that reliable there (e.g. broken chargers + delivering less po…

Netherlands here, it's great. Idk about Spain.

Re: EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

#83

Post by acdha »

roxolotl wrote: post #4

It’s so wild to me to make a multiyear purchasing decision based upon recent events. My next car will be an EV not suggesting it’s a bad decision however I’m still blown away by statistics like this.

EVs have been better for ~90% of the driving most people do for a decade, but a lot of people held back because they fixated on things like epic road trips or needing to haul many sheets of plywood.

What a price shock does is force people to acknowledge how much money they’ve been spending on edge-cases, making many of them reconsider how much it’s really worth to, for example, go on an all-day drive without every stopping for more than a few minutes or whether the SUV/pickup truck aesthetic is worth paying 50% more every day.

Re: EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

#84

Post by NoLinkToMe »

etchalon wrote: post #15

We went with a PHEV when I renewed our lease last month, specifically because gas prices

PHEVs are typically discouraged in many countries nowadays, because drivers fall into one of two categories: A) plug-in to charge on a (virtually) daily basis at home B) plug-in to charge as necessary, some of whom have no home-charging (apartment-dweller)

PHEVs make no sense for category (A) people because there is no range-anxiety if you home-charge every day. Typical drivers do 40km a day on average. Even an entry-level Tesla model 3 has >530km of range, and goes up to 750km for the model 3.

PHEVs also make no sense for category (B) people, because the PHEV has just 50km of range. So if you don't plug in all the time, you're basically driving a gasoline car with an extra engine and a battery, increasing weight (= fuel) and maintenance cost.

Various studies of real-world usage have shown PHEVs are less efficient because the behavior of its drivers. They'd be better off just driving a regular hybrid, like a Corolla.

The only area where PHEVs make sense are people who drive short-distances on a daily basis, plug in the car always at home, yet make frequent (say weekend) long trips of 6+ hours of driving without any breaks, or long trips to remote areas with no charging infrastructure. This is a pretty rare combination. Most PHEVs are traditionally owned by urbanites lured by a green dream and green subsidies, who're better off getting a pure EV or just an efficient boring hybrid.

Re: EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

#85

Post by orwin »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #62
orwin wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's try to not glorify terrorism too much and still pretend the west do not target civilians and civilian infrastructure please. Remember, the pesky Arabs are the one who target civilians, that's why they are terrorists. We only occasionally target civilians, and when it happens, it's because they are evil and support an evil man, so we aren't.

It's good to be angry about hypocrisy. Since both sides target civilians, the only winner will be whoever is more powerful.

There will be no winner, only a side who loose less. I am not really angry at the hypocrisy, i am angry that people act like cheerleaders for war crime and terrorist attacks. The hypocrisy is a given, and tbh, it's okay. I just want people to understand what they are cheering for, and in this case, it is terrorism.

If you support this kind of strike, you support the same kind of strike as 9/11. And it's okay, you do you, i just want you to realize that.

Re: EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

#86

Post by tim333 »

Neywiny wrote: post #13

I'm not considering replacing my car just yet, but supplementing with an electric scooter or bike might be nice

I recommend e-bikes. If you get a folding one it can go in the boot of the car and save you on parking. I own a petrol car but hardly use it as the bike is handier for me.

Re: EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

#87

Post by Neywiny »

tim333 wrote: post #86
Neywiny wrote: post #13

I'm not considering replacing my car just yet, but supplementing with an electric scooter or bike might be nice

I recommend e-bikes. If you get a folding one it can go in the boot of the car and save you on parking. I own a petrol car but hardly use it as the bike is handier for me.

I think I agree but currently it's analysis paralysis. Just had a huge repair bill come in for the car and to be blunt if I could supplement its daily wear and tear I'd appreciate it, so the fire under me is starting to get lit.

Re: EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

#88

Post by inigyou »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #61
inigyou wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no evidence that the USA can or will turn Iran into a parking lot. Which countries, besides the USA, has the USA turned into parking lots so far? There is plenty of evidence the strait will remain closed and the USA will continue dying until the USA surrenders. Notwithstanding that nice toddler-level reversal, "you can't close the strait, I'm closing the strait!"

The US is dying at the slowest rate of nearly every country outside of Africa.

Irrelevant. The war is between the USA/Israel and Iran, every other country is collateral damage until they decide to join the side of Iran to reduce their collateral damage - which they have been reluctant to, so far, except for China (which is winning as always).

Re: EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

#89

Post by Benedicht »

bormaj wrote: post #48

Slightly off-topic, but can anyone comment on the quality of the EV charging infrastructure in the EU? Outside of owning an EV and charging it at home/work, are fast chargers reliable and abundant enough for road trips? I recently looked into renting an EV in Spain and instead opted for gas. It seems like the public charging infrastructure is just not all that reliable there (e.g. broken chargers + delivering less po…

My brother-in-law doing trips between England and Hungary with an EV.

Re: EV demand up 50% in France and Germany since Iran war

#90

Post by cicko »

NoLinkToMe wrote: post #81
cicko wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That makes no sense to me. I've had an EV for five years and right now the infrastructure is fantastic in comparison. There are chargers everywhere, they're fast enough, and the prices are reasonable. The batteries are also quite large. I see absolutely no reason to buy an IC car any more. Many people have solar panels installed, making the commute practically free.

I think at the upper range, and for Teslas, this is true. But for the rest, not quite yet. Suppose you buy an entry-level Renault 5, the WLTP range is 310km. In mild conditions you typically get 85-90% of that, enough for the majority of people. But in winter you get 65% of that, so 195km, on a new battery. And after 5 years that may be 165km in winter, and that's just not great. With home-charging that still is enou…

Mate, I too live in an apartment and have had Zoe 41kWh (Type2-only) for several years. I've been through all that, including several 900+km trips. It's not as bad as it sounds. I'll reiterate - with CCS you don't really worry about charging. Those 310km is enough for over 80% of anyone's trips. The guy who bought 9yr-old Zoe drove away 278km with 28km left when he got home. Recently I've got a Cupra Born with 77kWh and couldn't care less about the charging infrastructure anymore. It's just a regular car at this point. Charging on the street is even more practical than driving to the nearest petrol station.
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