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It's death

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Re: It's death

#81

Post by RetroTechie »

jadar wrote: post #33

“Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.” - Ecclesiastes 12:13-14

Just a thought I had recently:

Imagine you'd spend your life creating useful inventions, somehow improving this world, helping others, clean up pollution, etc. Making the lives of people currently alive and all their descendants just a little bit more fun, happy, comfortable or interesting.

Now imagine you'd spend your life doing shitty stuff that spoils the fun and makes life miserable for everyone & those that live after you.

Note that "all their descendants" could be many many billions or even trillions+ humans (if humanity manages to not go extinct 'soon'). That's ignoring other living creatures.

With that in mind, wouldn't it be a small sacrifice to put in a bit of effort to not screw things up for those that come after you?

No need to be a saint. It's about finding a balance between having some fun for yourself, while not spoiling the fun for others - presently alive or in the future.

Religion need not enter this consideration. If it helps/comforts anyone to use as guideline, power to them. But a simple "how would future humans look back on my actions?" does the job.

Re: It's death

#83

Post by mrguyorama »

BLKNSLVR wrote: post #27
smnplk wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And the afterlife also sucks apparently (although I don't personally believe in an afterlife). Why don't you believe in the experience after dying ?

I'm going to say it will be similar to the experience prior to birth / conception, ie. we were nothing, and to nothing we shall return. It's a scary feeling if you can grasp it. Grasping non-existence from within existence is difficult, I've consciously tried to do it and succeeded a couple of times, but it's fleeting and both times it affected my breathing and heart rate in a similar way to fear or panic or pain.

>Grasping non-existence from within existence is difficult, I've consciously tried to do it and succeeded a couple of times

How can you possibly assert you have succeeded at this?

Re: It's death

#84

Post by Hates_ »

SoftTalker wrote: post #76
ricardobeat wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if that is true. For large swaths of the population, raising a child is their biggest accomplishment. Justifiably so. Other accomplishments of note might be: a single conversation that helped someone change. Little acts that made the world a tiny bit better. Having brought happiness to other people. I like to think that is the meaning of not wasting your time – not just measuring your life's worth with a…

I guess I interpreted "of note" differently. Raising a child is not noteworthy, it's just normal. Millions of people do it. Nobody will be remembered for raising a child, except by the child himself. When I'm gone, I'll leave nothing "of note" behind. I haven't won any great prizes or set any records. I haven't authored any papers. I haven't invented anything that changed an industry. I haven't cured any diseases. My…

Raising a child is noteworthy. Same for the millions of people who do it now, and the millions of people who did it before them. Just because millions of people do it doesn't diminish the significance of it. Framing it as such, is like saying there's no point running a race if you don't come first. A personal victory is still a victory. If it matters to you, then that's all that matters. All of those things like authoring papers, winning great prizes, setting records, will all be eventually be lost to time.

Re: It's death

#85

Post by Eddy_Viscosity2 »

ViktorRay wrote: post #78
_factor wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not the lifestyle that makes some people unhappy, it’s the knowledge that there is suffering around the world they can do near nothing to stop. Not everyone frames their happiness solely on conditions within their own sphere. Knowledge comes with responsibility.

“It is not our part to master all the tides of the world, but to do what is in us for the succour of those years wherein we are set, uprooting the evil in the fields that we know, so that those who live after may have clean earth to till. What weather they shall have is not ours to rule.” The above quote is from a character from one of JRR Tolkien’s books. (Gandalf from Return of the King.) Tolkien fought in the Batt…

Another way of saying that is "be the change you want to see in the world". That's all anyone can do. In that you can't do more than that, by definition. But you can do less. Positive change comes only from those who make the choice to do what they can, however small and local that may be.

Re: It's death

#86

Post by canyp »

Hammershaft wrote: post #55
canyp wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I go through that exercise of visualizing the void and it is fascinating and terrifying at the same time, especially if you do it before going to sleep. That being said, you can't just assume that existence is bounded by your living memories. You might as well have been everything instead of nothing prior to being spawned and you just don't remember it.

If you're a materialist and you think there is no afterlife then I don't believe there would be a void. There's no mechanism for "you" to perceive a void or perceive time. Its the difference between: "I see nothing when I close my eyes" (actually you 'see' darkness over time) and... "I see nothing through my elbow" (You really don't see anything through your elbow because the capacity for it just doesn't exist.) Even…

Being a materialist and claiming that everything is the consequence of physical phenomena is great, but then you have a lot of homework to do. So I see no more strength in its claims than in the contrarian ones.

Re: It's death

#87

Post by canyp »

ed_mercer wrote: post #36
canyp wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I go through that exercise of visualizing the void and it is fascinating and terrifying at the same time, especially if you do it before going to sleep. That being said, you can't just assume that existence is bounded by your living memories. You might as well have been everything instead of nothing prior to being spawned and you just don't remember it.

I've always wondered why doing it before sleep amplifies the anxiety

I believe the fact that it is night time does a lot to it, since we're just wired for a healthy fear of the dark. Coupled with consciousness fading into sleep, it seems to open up a lot of dread.

Re: It's death

#88

Post by canyp »

BLKNSLVR wrote: post #42
canyp wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I go through that exercise of visualizing the void and it is fascinating and terrifying at the same time, especially if you do it before going to sleep. That being said, you can't just assume that existence is bounded by your living memories. You might as well have been everything instead of nothing prior to being spawned and you just don't remember it.

> you can't just assume that existence is bounded by your living memories I was going to raise that, but couldn't find a short enough way to describe it properly. Something like: Existence beyond what you can actually remember doesn't matter because it's outside any bounds of practical discussion; it should be excluded from consideration. The same way it's impossible to predict anything 'before the big bang' because…

It may as well be outside our bounds and unverifiable, but that doesn't mean it doesn't matter or that it shouldn't be part of "practical" discussion, whatever you consider "practical" there. You still have a brain to think about these things.

I do personally believe the latter part. I did not mean to suggest the before/after experience was going to look anything like your current one.

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