There's an interesting connection to draw between liminal spaces (especially the Backrooms variety) and the "latent space" concept from AI, both mechanically and sociologically. Basically, generative AI is an industrial-scale blend of almost every image and concept in human history, and within the labyrinthine, uninterpretable neural networks that power it, you can "find" every conceivable combination of objects, sty…
This should be an essay.
How liminalism became the defining aesthetic
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Re: How liminalism became the defining aesthetic
#82Calling liminalism the "defining" aesthetic of our time is a bit much (though I get the article is trying to hitch its wagon to the Backrooms, aka the "current popular thing"). It's an aesthetic microniche, about as popular as vaporwave, or cyberpunk, grunge, or Y2K (think flip phones, bulky plastic cameras, etc.). There's a ton of these, and some are surprising: for example, there's even been a relatively recent rev…
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Re: How liminalism became the defining aesthetic
#83Earlier quoted context omitted.
Submarine? Astro-turf or native-advertising, maybe? Or perhaps I misunderstood.
Basically the same. An “article” planted by a PR firm, where the promotional target just happens to pop up about halfway through.
I'm not sure this magazine is nearly popular enough for that to be worth it.
Re: How liminalism became the defining aesthetic
#84Earlier quoted context omitted.
Also, for places metro stations/gyms it's more of a maintenance and hygiene thing rather than an aesthetic. I'm currently in Paris so I've seen a ton of metro stations recently and really, unless you arrived in the dead of night so that you could snap an empty photo like the one in the article, there's nothing much liminal about them. A space can't be liminal if it's packed with people, buskers, beggars, dogs, etc. I…
> I'm currently in Paris so I've seen a ton of metro stations recently and really, unless you arrived in the dead of night so that you could snap an empty photo like the one in the article, there's nothing much liminal about them. Liminal does not mean minimal. It means in-between, neither here nor there but in the interstices, transitional. Dictionary.app in macOS Sequoia defines (with example usage) "liminal" as >…
"Language as she is spoke" is very often at odds with literal dictionary definitions. So you're right that a liminal space is a transitional space, and that a metro is by definition that. But linimal aesthetic is different, especially as has recently become popular. It means a space that gives you that feeling of being between, of emptiness, introspection. A metro station absolutely does not have this aesthetic, except maybe at some mysterious hour where there's no one using it (and I've used them at both closing and opening times, they're never empty).
Re: How liminalism became the defining aesthetic
#85There's an interesting connection to draw between liminal spaces (especially the Backrooms variety) and the "latent space" concept from AI, both mechanically and sociologically. Basically, generative AI is an industrial-scale blend of almost every image and concept in human history, and within the labyrinthine, uninterpretable neural networks that power it, you can "find" every conceivable combination of objects, sty…
I can definitely see how the vast spaces "inside" of an AI model (more precisely, the space of every possible output for every possible input) are similar to the backrooms in that they are huge, related to human activity yet impossible for any human to fully comprehend, sort of "haunted" by humanity yet devoid of it, dreamlike, and so on.
The connection between AI and dreams is interesting in its own right. I am reminded of Google's DeepDream specifically, with its bizarre images that yet seem strongly reminiscent of how humans actually perceive things on some level.
Re: How liminalism became the defining aesthetic
#86Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I'm currently in Paris so I've seen a ton of metro stations recently and really, unless you arrived in the dead of night so that you could snap an empty photo like the one in the article, there's nothing much liminal about them. Liminal does not mean minimal. It means in-between, neither here nor there but in the interstices, transitional. Dictionary.app in macOS Sequoia defines (with example usage) "liminal" as >…
"Language as she is spoke" is very often at odds with literal dictionary definitions. So you're right that a liminal space is a transitional space, and that a metro is by definition that. But linimal aesthetic is different, especially as has recently become popular. It means a space that gives you that feeling of being between, of emptiness, introspection. A metro station absolutely does not have this aesthetic, exce…
> But linimal aesthetic is different, especially as has recently become popular.
Your articulation of a liminal aesthetic hits upon the tension inherit in the word “liminal”.
By definition “liminal” signals “in between” which connotes an unsettledness or indeterminacy, or what in other realms is called the uncanny. This liminal aesthetic, at its core, is shot through with a sense of the uncanny, and empty devoid spaces where normally there is a lot of traffic convey this aesthetic clearly and succinctly.
Thank you for drawing this distinction.
My intent when referring to the denotation of “liminal” was to remind that even familiar places, such as bustling train stations and busy airport terminals, are also liminal spaces even if they don’t conform to current representations of the liminal _aesthetic_. By preserving the denotation of the word “liminal”, we can defamiliarize such spaces and recover (or emphasize) their liminality.
All of which is the message of art like Brian Eno’s “Music for Airports”. Who doesn’t appreciate the defamiliarization of our “mundane” traversals of the realms we inhabit?
Re: How liminalism became the defining aesthetic
#87Calling liminalism the "defining" aesthetic of our time is a bit much (though I get the article is trying to hitch its wagon to the Backrooms, aka the "current popular thing"). It's an aesthetic microniche, about as popular as vaporwave, or cyberpunk, grunge, or Y2K (think flip phones, bulky plastic cameras, etc.). There's a ton of these, and some are surprising: for example, there's even been a relatively recent rev…
Also, for places metro stations/gyms it's more of a maintenance and hygiene thing rather than an aesthetic. I'm currently in Paris so I've seen a ton of metro stations recently and really, unless you arrived in the dead of night so that you could snap an empty photo like the one in the article, there's nothing much liminal about them. A space can't be liminal if it's packed with people, buskers, beggars, dogs, etc. I…
Indeed, I've been in airports where I had to go down a long and eerily empty hallway, and I assumed it was just a design work-around due to needing to get a tiny number of people from A to B without breaking the security and safety perimeter. Without that security need, e.g., in a regular city, that hallway would be replaced with walking a block or two outdoors.
Re: How liminalism became the defining aesthetic
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
I never got why Frutiger Aero got so popular as a ‘nostalgic’ aesthetic, when it’s basically the Windows Vista, GNOME 3 (the awful rewrite of GNOME 2), KDE 4.0 (the buggy, emo black rewrite of KDE 3) look? It was the lowest point of computer graphics. Who the hell is nostalgic for that? Probably just kids that had their formative years in those ~2-3 years. Not sure you can even call it a niche. I’m a fan on the vapor…
Its fascinating to me. I grew up in the UK home computer scene of the mid 80s-early 90s. After this, the Frutiger Aero aesthetic seemed to me redolent of the total corporatization of what previously seemed a much more human and approachable computer world. Now everything was behind glass, impossibly polished by unfathomable, expensive machines. I found it totally alienating.
Same, I hated when everything transitioned to it and became harder to read as a result. Frutiger Aero was a sterile sort of cheerful in a way only a CEO could think was relatable. It basically marked the turning point where the UI stopped being something janky that felt human made, into a mass produced corporate template.
Looking at it felt like the visual equivalent of licking soap.
Every time I see it now, I can only think “good riddance”.
Re: How liminalism became the defining aesthetic
#89Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Language as she is spoke" is very often at odds with literal dictionary definitions. So you're right that a liminal space is a transitional space, and that a metro is by definition that. But linimal aesthetic is different, especially as has recently become popular. It means a space that gives you that feeling of being between, of emptiness, introspection. A metro station absolutely does not have this aesthetic, exce…
> But linimal aesthetic is different, especially as has recently become popular. Your articulation of a liminal aesthetic hits upon the tension inherit in the word “liminal”. By definition “liminal” signals “in between” which connotes an unsettledness or indeterminacy, or what in other realms is called the uncanny. This liminal aesthetic, at its core, is shot through with a sense of the uncanny, and empty devoid spac…
Good luck preserving the meaning of words. Words have no meaning outside how people use them to express ideas. Words can and do change to mean different things, or even 'literally' the opposite of themselves.
Re: How liminalism became the defining aesthetic
#90Earlier quoted context omitted.
But the abandonment of a place which should be filled with life is a huge aspect of the liminal art movement. It speaks to the hollowing out of public life in north america and britain.
Is the abandonment of places that should be filled with life a defining aspect of today? Which places? Malls & COVID? I guess they exist but are they especially prevalent today?
Yes, a lot of public spaces are dying or dead. If you don't have these spaces in your area you are certainly the only exception.