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Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

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Re: Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

#81

Post by tombert »

WarmWash wrote: post #70
tombert wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use the Interactive Brokers MCP pretty heavily. I don't do any cool automatic fun "trading", but instead I use it to have "pseudo-QQQ". I didn't like the relatively high fees for QQQ, and I realized that Invesco releases the weights for QQQ for free. I also think Tesla is too overvalued, and I want to avoid the SpaceX IPO. With the Interactive Brokers MCP, I just feed it the CSV of QQQ's weights, tell it to remove…

I have thought about this but snag on rebalancing, because it would create a taxable event, or be drawn out over months/years. Although maybe a bit spicier, VGT is half the cost of QQQ, so that is what my "NASDAQ" has been. I also blend in VTI to cut the volatility a bit, which is 1/3 the cost of VGT.

I'm doing the same strategy for rebalancing that QQQ does, and I figure that the headache of tax time is a "Tom in 11 months from now"'s problem :)

Some tax software nowadays will allow you to simply upload the tax documents with all the transactions and it will tabulate everything for you, so I don't think it will be too hard for me.

I'll admit that there's primarily just kind of a coolness factor to be able to say that I ripped off and copied QQQ without any fees, but I do genuinely like the idea that I can avoid companies that I think are terrible in the process.

Re: Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

#82

Post by adithyassekhar »

nine_k wrote: post #68
demorro wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are a member of society. Society stops people doing harmful things to themselves all the time.

This should be limited to giving advice (education, warning, explicit consent), unless there's harm to third parties. Because, you know, certain actions and even thoughts can lead to eternal damnation in Hell, according to what a society may think. Would you prefer the society to hold you off from that?

People claim this all the time to win internet arguments but the truth is we all have a moral code.

If you see a child playing with a loaded gun, you won’t stop it?

Re: Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

#83

Post by yladiz »

nine_k wrote: post #68
demorro wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are a member of society. Society stops people doing harmful things to themselves all the time.

This should be limited to giving advice (education, warning, explicit consent), unless there's harm to third parties. Because, you know, certain actions and even thoughts can lead to eternal damnation in Hell, according to what a society may think. Would you prefer the society to hold you off from that?

Harm to others includes cost to society in general.

Re: Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

#84

Post by [deleted] »

tombert wrote: post #28
infecto wrote: post #4

I don’t understand this constant fascination with having language models trade stocks. Language models are very useful tools but not aligned at all with generating alpha.

I use the Interactive Brokers MCP pretty heavily. I don't do any cool automatic fun "trading", but instead I use it to have "pseudo-QQQ". I didn't like the relatively high fees for QQQ, and I realized that Invesco releases the weights for QQQ for free. I also think Tesla is too overvalued, and I want to avoid the SpaceX IPO. With the Interactive Brokers MCP, I just feed it the CSV of QQQ's weights, tell it to remove…

[deleted]

Re: Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

#85

Post by klodolph »

tombert wrote: post #79
klodolph wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it is not possible for you (personally) to buy the underlying components of leveraged ETFs.

Yeah, actually I think I was getting confused on some of the terminology. It looks like you're right. Still, as you said, just mimicking regular QQQ is achievable.

It’s achievable. It’s called “direct indexing”, and there are some extra costs associated with it, so for most investors, I think it is cheaper to get QQQ. You can flip that around with tax loss harvesting but I don’t understand that strategy and I can’t explain it.

You also don’t need AI to do this. Before AI, the main barrier to direct indexing was the amount of capital you need. That is still true.

Re: Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

#86

Post by mistrial9 »

pants2 wrote: post #67
tyre wrote: post #3

If there was anything missing from the average American’s economic wellbeing, it was the ability to create bespoke financial products to scalably make bets against informed professional traders while they sleep.

I disagree, AI agents could help level the playing field. Citadel doesn't have any AI models that are better than what you or I have. Market data is more accessible than ever. As LLMs get better at trading, the difference in capability between you and a professional trader gets smaller. Also, Claude knows about a lot of the traps that consumers can fall into: spread, execution, risk concentration, etc. -- high chance…

I believe that your individual ability to execute an order is constrained such that some of the difference is removed. On the other hand, the overall thesis has merits IMHO

Re: Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

#87

Post by nine_k »

adithyassekhar wrote: post #82
nine_k wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This should be limited to giving advice (education, warning, explicit consent), unless there's harm to third parties. Because, you know, certain actions and even thoughts can lead to eternal damnation in Hell, according to what a society may think. Would you prefer the society to hold you off from that?

People claim this all the time to win internet arguments but the truth is we all have a moral code. If you see a child playing with a loaded gun, you won’t stop it?

A child is not a fully autonomous person. I would of course take the loaded gun from the child, unload it, and explain its dangers to the child.

Money, in any form, may be as dangerous as a loaded gun, trading stocks or not. Most adults are careful with money, as they are with loaded guns. The problem is that some parties may try to make trading stocks (even leveraged) look much easier and safer than it is. It's like giving somebody a real loaded gun, while making it look like a toy gun, safe even for a child. And this of course needs to be regulated: not the trading, but the disclosure. This is not a toy.

Re: Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

#88

Post by demorro »

pants2 wrote: post #67
tyre wrote: post #3

If there was anything missing from the average American’s economic wellbeing, it was the ability to create bespoke financial products to scalably make bets against informed professional traders while they sleep.

I disagree, AI agents could help level the playing field. Citadel doesn't have any AI models that are better than what you or I have. Market data is more accessible than ever. As LLMs get better at trading, the difference in capability between you and a professional trader gets smaller. Also, Claude knows about a lot of the traps that consumers can fall into: spread, execution, risk concentration, etc. -- high chance…

What is the point of having a speculative market if everyone has access to the same information and capabilities? You might as well just direct deposit a proportional share of all economic growth relative to investment into every citizens account and be done with it.

Re: Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

#89

Post by tombert »

klodolph wrote: post #85
tombert wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, actually I think I was getting confused on some of the terminology. It looks like you're right. Still, as you said, just mimicking regular QQQ is achievable.

It’s achievable. It’s called “direct indexing”, and there are some extra costs associated with it, so for most investors, I think it is cheaper to get QQQ. You can flip that around with tax loss harvesting but I don’t understand that strategy and I can’t explain it. You also don’t need AI to do this. Before AI, the main barrier to direct indexing was the amount of capital you need. That is still true.

I have enough capital to where I can do everything with the incremental share threshold of Interactive Brokers; as such I don't have to deal with the fees associated with normal direct indexing.

Re: Robinhood now lets your AI agents trade stocks

#90

Post by demorro »

nine_k wrote: post #87
adithyassekhar wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People claim this all the time to win internet arguments but the truth is we all have a moral code. If you see a child playing with a loaded gun, you won’t stop it?

A child is not a fully autonomous person. I would of course take the loaded gun from the child, unload it, and explain its dangers to the child. Money, in any form, may be as dangerous as a loaded gun, trading stocks or not. Most adults are careful with money, as they are with loaded guns. The problem is that some parties may try to make trading stocks (even leveraged) look much easier and safer than it is. It's like…

Who are you to decide that a child is not a fully autonomous person? Sounds like you're imposing a normative rule based on societally derived presuppositions of right and wrong, which is exactly the point. We're just haggling over where the line should be drawn and you think it should be drawn somewhere further back than others do, but there's no truth to be found here.
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