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Internet traffic in Iran increasing

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Re: Internet traffic in Iran increasing

#81

Post by wsgeorge »

hollerith wrote: post #68
rayiner wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and that it's the fault of the US and others that Russia is so backwards and poor Why is Russia so backwards and poor? Russia and Iran are two countries that seem to way underperform their fundamentals.

A lot of it is because transportation is quite difficult. Even today huge tracts in Russia are without any roads. On the opposite end of the spectrum is the US, where even before the railroad and the automobile, transportation was quite easy, with navigable rivers flowing through the best farmland in the world. Another big piece is how easy it is to invade; how hard it is to defend. History records 50 invasions of Ru…

> (Yes, the invader could try to get Mexico to agree to host the invading army, but the US would probably find out about that plan and respond by either blockading Mexico or invading it if it doesn't immediately abandon the plan.)

Curious, how viable would this strategy be when invading via Canada?

Re: Internet traffic in Iran increasing

#82

Post by esseph »

t-3 wrote: post #54
bluegatty wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Don't fall for the trap where the US and Israel paints Iran as some authoritarian censor. The US is far more authoritarian" This is total delusion, honestly, it's why people in these systems will remain trapped for a long time. America has many problems but when people in places like Iran start on this bandwagon, it's evidence of inability to just weigh reality in the face of emotional rhetoric. Nobody is suggesting…

> Iran has a ruthlessly oppressive regime, not even comparable to that of the US. Not comparable in domestic affairs... in foreign affairs the situation is reversed. US is by far the most violent, untrustworthy, and oppressive in the world, while Iran looks pretty peaceful and harmless in comparison.

I mean, Iran has been firing missiles at 14 different countries in this war. Not exactly saints.

Re: Internet traffic in Iran increasing

#83

Post by esseph »

nostrademons wrote: post #12

The weird thing is: Iran seems to be acting like the war is ending, and that their peace plan has been accepted, and yet now it's the Trump administration that says it's all fake news. In the past the Trump administration has claimed the war was ending and Iran said (truthfully) it's all fake news. It makes me wonder if something has shifted with the internal power dynamics in Iran, and the civilian government at lea…

> Also relatedly, Trump is now doubling down on U.S. demands and threats of more military action. This is what you do if you sense your opponent is weak.

It's really the opposite. Trump is grasping at anything he can use as leverage in a deal he doesn't seem to be able to close.

Re: Internet traffic in Iran increasing

#84

Post by t-3 »

esseph wrote: post #82
t-3 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Iran has a ruthlessly oppressive regime, not even comparable to that of the US. Not comparable in domestic affairs... in foreign affairs the situation is reversed. US is by far the most violent, untrustworthy, and oppressive in the world, while Iran looks pretty peaceful and harmless in comparison.

I mean, Iran has been firing missiles at 14 different countries in this war. Not exactly saints.

They didn't start the war. Those countries are hosting bases and troops and providing aid to the enemy who attacked them multiple times while they were negotiating. Why shouldn't they strike US bases and US vassals when fighting a war against the US? Why should they be polite when the US doesn't even honor basic diplomatic norms, let alone pretend to care about international law or rules of engagement?

Re: Internet traffic in Iran increasing

#85

Post by t-3 »

dnautics wrote: post #75
jmyeet wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The world already has come down on Iran's side. It's pretty much the US and Israel (and maybe the UAE) against the world. Trump has bemoaned the lack of international support. Use of bases and airpsace have been spotty. And this is only going to get worse once winter hits in Europe and people start seeing their electricity and heating bills. Asia (minus China and Japan) are the most vulnerable because they're almost…

we shall see you see, the problem is this "unprovoked attack by the biggest bully on the planet" framing requires some sense of "international order" but thats a myth, always has been, and, now its being seen for what it is. in that world iran doesn't do so well, especially since the claims it makes (controlling the hormuz) depend on rejecting the international order. you cant have your cake and eat it too. im not sa…

Turkey charges fees for ships crossing the Bosphorus and Dardanelles. That's not illegal or against the international order. The only countries strongly opposing an Iranian/Omani fee are the US, Israel, and Europe, because they are enemies of Iran. Other countries just add it to the cost of doing business.

Re: Internet traffic in Iran increasing

#86

Post by t-3 »

whatever1 wrote: post #62
rayiner wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and that it's the fault of the US and others that Russia is so backwards and poor Why is Russia so backwards and poor? Russia and Iran are two countries that seem to way underperform their fundamentals.

Because their institutions are completely corrupt. There are no rules to the game so the powerful take everything. It is a smaller pie but if I can have it all, why do I care? Prosperity correlates with powerful institutions (not necessarily democratic). But ultimately you need a set of rules that even the state has to follow.

It's ultimately a cultural issue. Russia never really experienced the liberalization and philosophical transformation of the enlightenment that occurred in Europe, they practiced monstrous feudalism until suddenly transitioning to socialism, which quickly became just as monstrous. Rules without ideology or philosophy are just things to be gamed - exactly as occurs often in those cultures without strong rule-of-law ideologies and societal game-theory countermeasures against corruption and malfeasance. Our politicians would rather twist the laws to make corruption legal than engage in illegal corruption because the drawbacks of illegality are so large. Russian politicians would rather do things extralegally because the system is facade and the real system is one of might makes right so the laws don't apply to them.

Re: Internet traffic in Iran increasing

#87

Post by xiphias2 »

soco wrote: post #79
xiphias2 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would not, but it's clearly not just a war with Ukraine. Europe is sending the jet engines for the drones that are shooting Moscow, and Germany is very actively preparing for war with Russia. It's not the first time in history that this has been done, and Russia still remembers.

Then said Russia could withdraw their multinational troops, stop their international drones, and enjoy peace for the first time in their history. Because Russian drones have European parts as well (and Chinese and and), and the army recruits are not only Russian either.

I think you just implicitly agreed with me that Europe is in proxy war with Russia and it's escalating.

Re: Internet traffic in Iran increasing

#88

Post by NordStreamYacht »

hypeatei wrote: post #51
NordStreamYacht wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Does U.S. intelligence know something we don't? Unlikely. They thought a dose of shock and awe would get people out on the streets for a rapid regime change and it didn't work.

I don't think U.S. intelligence thought any part of this war was a good idea or justified. There were two National Intelligence Estimates (a panel of all 18 agencies in the IC) that concluded Iran was not developing nuclear weapons. There has also been reporting that a top general in the Joint Chiefs of Staff warned Trump about starting a conflict with Iran[0]. The only party that believes, or wants others to believe…

So the only reasons to attack Iran where

1. Trump had a bee in his bonnet since the 80s

2. Iran has oil

3. Israel willed it

4. Disrupt global energy markets

5. All of the above

Re: Internet traffic in Iran increasing

#89

Post by soco »

xiphias2 wrote: post #87
soco wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then said Russia could withdraw their multinational troops, stop their international drones, and enjoy peace for the first time in their history. Because Russian drones have European parts as well (and Chinese and and), and the army recruits are not only Russian either.

I think you just implicitly agreed with me that Europe is in proxy war with Russia and it's escalating.

I think you just implicitly agreed that what I said is true - that it would be enough for Russia to go back home and everybody would be at peace.

Re: Internet traffic in Iran increasing

#90

Post by xiphias2 »

soco wrote: post #89
xiphias2 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you just implicitly agreed with me that Europe is in proxy war with Russia and it's escalating.

I think you just implicitly agreed that what I said is true - that it would be enough for Russia to go back home and everybody would be at peace.

Sure, that's what a war is about
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