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12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

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Re: 12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

#81

Post by dessimus »

calf wrote: post #66
bennettnate5 wrote: post #47

> Despite this promising start, the conservation experiment wasn't to last, after a rival juice manufacturer called TicoFruit sued Del Oro, alleging that its competitor had "defiled a national park". No good deed goes unpunished--wild that the competitor company successfully sued them.

Even a consequentialist should accept that it would have taken 16 years to realize it was actually a good thing to do with orange peels.

The article says they returned after that long having forgotten about the experiment. I think they would have recognized there were positive results long before that if someone happened to be checking in at say Year 2, 5 or 10. It not like the land was still barren piles of orange peel at Year 14 and then suddenly Yahtzee!

Re: 12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

#82

Post by makr17 »

ethagnawl wrote: post #12

It's recently occurred to me how "valuable" today's trash is likely to be considered in the future. I'll focus on organics here but I think the plastics will be equally valuable, too. I have no idea what % of American households compost or live in places which offer municipal compost pickup but I imagine it's in the single digits. As evidenced by this article, compost is/can be an incredibly powerful agent of change:…

California has a low-double-digit percentage of the US population, and mandates organic waste separation/collection.

https://calrecycle.ca.gov/Organics/SLCP/collection/

Re: 12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

#83

Post by subscribed »

nomel wrote: post #69
rustystump wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I may be wrong but isnt most of the tree carbon capture over stated as in the overwhelming majority comes from algae in the oceans? While forests are great they are not the best focus iirc compared to the oceans.

Yes. A potential method of capture is to seed the ocean with more iron [1], to help the algae. I assume that China will be the first to do these sorts of things, since the west will be too hogtied in regulations, lawsuits, and bureaucracy. [1] https://www.hawaii.edu/news/2026/02/17/ocean-iron-fertilizat...

China could definitely do this, to offset the minuscule of the destruction they do with the dark fishing fleets around (and possibly in) protected marine areas.

Re: 12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

#84

Post by hommelix »

zahlman wrote: post #80
acomjean wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked for a time designing and building landfills. Nothing really rots in them typically as it’s really dry and don’t have good access to oxygen. Modern landfills are like giant plastic bags. This is to protect ground water. Decomposition as noted releases methane. Some landfills gather it in pipes and “flare” it )burn. They have to vent the gas as a full landfill is covered by a plastic cap to prevent water infil…

> Some landfills gather it in pipes and “flare” it )burn. Can useful energy be recovered from this?

At some sites, the methane is burned in gas engine to generate electricity. Some sites build a CHP and resales the heat for district heating. The engines may need more maintenance due to silicate in the gas.

Re: 12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

#85

Post by bluGill »

zahlman wrote: post #80
acomjean wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked for a time designing and building landfills. Nothing really rots in them typically as it’s really dry and don’t have good access to oxygen. Modern landfills are like giant plastic bags. This is to protect ground water. Decomposition as noted releases methane. Some landfills gather it in pipes and “flare” it )burn. They have to vent the gas as a full landfill is covered by a plastic cap to prevent water infil…

> Some landfills gather it in pipes and “flare” it )burn. Can useful energy be recovered from this?

Yes, any landfill of any size is going to clean this up a bit and run it through a generator. They can get contracts from the utility to use so much power per week (whatever the tank capacity iso and since the utility controls when it is on (that is when other renewables are low) they get a higher price. The details are complex, but thus is very valuable green renewable (we can debate how green and renewable eslewhere) energy to a utility.

Re: 12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

#86

Post by 6510 »

sophacles wrote: post #44
jillesvangurp wrote: post #41

Turning degraded land back into fertile land is actually very feasible and not as hopeless as it may seem. A lot of the damage people have done to landscapes in recent centuries is still reversible. There are a lot of examples all over the world of people turning dried out and heavily eroded land back into fertile land with great bio diversity. Sometimes at small scale, and sometimes at very large scale. Often even j…

Often you don't even need seeds from neighboring land. The soil that remains often still has seeds sitting dormant waiting for conditions to return to healthy.

It once struck me that it is unimaginative to assume this is their first planet.

Re: 12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

#87

Post by bluGill »

CrzyLngPwd wrote: post #75

I have 45acres of low-grade agricultural land, and if someone dropped 12k tons of compostable material on it, I'd be delighted. Where do I sign up?

Ask your county extention are dnr. Different states do this differently but most states have programs with experts who know what works in your area and what the options are.

Re: 12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

#88

Post by dgacmu »

mvdtnz wrote: post #74
dgacmu wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're getting downvoted but it's a reasonable question if posed in good faith. The tl;dr is that there are really a few options for what could happen to those orange peels: (1) Landfill burial (1a) Without methane capture and use: Produces methane, relatively high short term warming potential. (1b) With methane capture and use: Ends up as CO2 after burning the methane. (2) Composting (this approach) (2a) Mostly aero…

It's not a reasonable question. What's the alternative for the orange peels? They were going to rot and release that CO2 whether they did it in a big pile here or somewhere else.

That's why I said if asked in good faith. :-)

But seriously GP could have had a mental model that landfilled orange peels might sit there for a long time -- which depending on conditions and food could be true on human scales (like 10-40 years) but not on the scale of 100 years. Especially if the conditions were dry -- a dry orange peel is pretty robust. That's not likely to be the case in Costa Rica, but I'll forgive some naivety here absent demonstrated malice.

Re: 12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

#89

Post by rayiner »

IG_Semmelweiss wrote: post #50
roboror wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Proud to report residential composting is now mandatory in NYC.

Please elaborate. From what i know based on prior research, most metro (including NYC) recycling is effectively a scam. How do you mandate composting in NYC ? Are you implying that all buildings have now must build a 3rd chute specifically for compost ? And who's picking up that compost ? NYC Trash collection ? I've seen compost vending machines in my visits to NYC and a few other places, but i've yet anyone using th…

> most metro (including NYC) recycling is effectively a scam. How do you mandate composting in NYC

Also a scam.

Re: 12k Tons of Dumped Orange Peel Grew into a Landscape Nobody Expected (2017)

#90

Post by 6510 »

schrectacular wrote: post #22
ethagnawl wrote: post #12

It's recently occurred to me how "valuable" today's trash is likely to be considered in the future. I'll focus on organics here but I think the plastics will be equally valuable, too. I have no idea what % of American households compost or live in places which offer municipal compost pickup but I imagine it's in the single digits. As evidenced by this article, compost is/can be an incredibly powerful agent of change:…

The thought occurred to me some 25+ years ago that today's landfills will be tomorrow's mines. I hope it isn't true but taking the very long view I'm afraid it will be.

A british inventor created a setup with two long vibrating plates with ferrofluid in between. A flaky powder made from garbage was dumped in on one side and came out the other end beautifully separated in many layers by density. (with one mixed layers in between that went back in at the beginning) Innitially he "knew" it was silly to use something as expensive as ferrofluid but planned to try other substances if it worked. It turned out the process produced a lot more ferrofluid than it used.

No one was interested in further research.

edit: I see some research is now happening.

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