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OpenAI's fall from grace as investors race to Anthropic

latimes.com

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Re: OpenAI's fall from grace as investors race to Anthropic

#81

Post by binarysolo »

My loose understanding as someone adjacent to the AI model space is that you have good models that are costly and cheap models that are decent, so a lot of the publicly visible fights where Claude and ChatGPT leapfrog each other is the companies doing cost-benefit of how much optimization to do on the models before your userbase revolts because the agent "used to be great and now kinda sucks".

As a small business owner whose team is entirely in Google Workspace (Drive, Gmail, Chat -- so inbuilt RAG right there), I wonder if Gemini will be the darkhorse. As a user Gemini's a distinct third in "AI smarts", but most business owners aren't power users who are gonna setup Codex or Code to slurp up their work emails and internal docs/SOPs.

The article feels a touch clickbait-y since people love a good fight between the top players and OAI's lost a buncha public goodwill over the past year.

Re: OpenAI's fall from grace as investors race to Anthropic

#82

Post by ramraj07 »

Art9681 wrote: post #75
brookst wrote: post #3

I don’t know how OpenAI screwed this up. They had the best tech, the largest installed base, the best brand recognition. And somehow instead of prosecuting the lead in all areas, they got all hubristic and sloppy and just failed to iterate on the core product, while also failing to respond quickly when Anthropic showed that coding agents are the flywheel that makes the whole company faster. It’s like they thought the…

Aside from the fabricated drama and the trend chasing, OpenAI still has the best overall model and API service. Anthropic is really good, no doubt. But gpt-5.4 is a better model than even Opus, even if its a marginal advantage. I use both.

The advantage is marginal and sporadic, and its slower. Why would I use it over anthropic?

Re: OpenAI's fall from grace as investors race to Anthropic

#83

Post by BSOhealth »

The latest Opus routinely tells me the latest GPT Pro responses are much better. The GPT responses cost 10x more than GPT at least. And GPT takes 10’s of minutes. So unless and until I’m needing and ready for a really expensive “math checker” it gets left alone.

Re: OpenAI's fall from grace as investors race to Anthropic

#85

Post by anakaine »

binarysolo wrote: post #81

My loose understanding as someone adjacent to the AI model space is that you have good models that are costly and cheap models that are decent, so a lot of the publicly visible fights where Claude and ChatGPT leapfrog each other is the companies doing cost-benefit of how much optimization to do on the models before your userbase revolts because the agent "used to be great and now kinda sucks". As a small business own…

As a government based person who has witnessed multiple states (not in the US) move all operations off GCP because Google doesnt address sovereign risk, local data and hosting privacy requirements,and contracts well at all, where Microsoft and AWS do, I doubt Gemini will have as large a dark horse moment as it could. Copilot Enterprise can span across similar domains, and whilst it is very expensive per user it has the benefit of having existing contracts in place which it can bolt in to.

Re: OpenAI's fall from grace as investors race to Anthropic

#86

Post by [deleted] »

Art9681 wrote: post #75
brookst wrote: post #3

I don’t know how OpenAI screwed this up. They had the best tech, the largest installed base, the best brand recognition. And somehow instead of prosecuting the lead in all areas, they got all hubristic and sloppy and just failed to iterate on the core product, while also failing to respond quickly when Anthropic showed that coding agents are the flywheel that makes the whole company faster. It’s like they thought the…

Aside from the fabricated drama and the trend chasing, OpenAI still has the best overall model and API service. Anthropic is really good, no doubt. But gpt-5.4 is a better model than even Opus, even if its a marginal advantage. I use both.

[deleted]

Re: OpenAI's fall from grace as investors race to Anthropic

#87

Post by FireBeyond »

igtt wrote: post #15
hgoel wrote: post #12

I wonder how much of this is associated with Scam Altman's personal negative PR and Anthropic's recent PR wins. I'm inclined to think there isn't much of an association becauss investors don't seem very concerned with morality, but I know ~dozen developers that either switched to, or started using Claude in the past month or so, while not knowing anyone that uses Codex.

The issue is investors want discipline. They want to see the CEO communicate a path to profitability. Anthropic has - purely by focusing. OAI in contrast is all over the place and they haven’t shown they’ve learned. Zuckerberg got punished for his metaverse nonsense and investors were correct to be skeptical and reflect that in the stock price. Altman thinks he’s a god and the rules don’t apply to him. More fool him.

> Altman thinks he’s a god and the rules don’t apply to him.

The Sam curse. Took down Bankman-Fried before him...

Re: OpenAI's fall from grace as investors race to Anthropic

#88

Post by bhadass »

ramraj07 wrote: post #82
Art9681 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aside from the fabricated drama and the trend chasing, OpenAI still has the best overall model and API service. Anthropic is really good, no doubt. But gpt-5.4 is a better model than even Opus, even if its a marginal advantage. I use both.

The advantage is marginal and sporadic, and its slower. Why would I use it over anthropic?

I dunno, my experience mirrors the parent posters: we use opus for all our coding, but gpt 5.4 for all of our enterprise agentic work via api (much bigger amount of tokens). it just seems to be more optimized for this.

Re: OpenAI's fall from grace as investors race to Anthropic

#89

Post by ssl-3 »

noosphr wrote: post #18
hmartin wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of OI slop is this? 5.4 Extra high >> Opus 4.6

Depends on your work flow. I find that for human in the loop Gemini beats both.

I pay for both ChatGPT and Gemini.

I've finished (as in: it's done, it works, and I may never need to change it again) entire projects with ChatGPT and Codex. Sometimes it takes a lot of hand-holding to get there, but it does get there and (with the exception of 4o) it's been improving since the beginning.

In contrast: I can't even get Gemini Pro to give me any answers to the most primitive questions that aren't caked in prima facie lies without at least 4 interactions, in any context, ever. The output is consistently and ridiculously garish with its insessant self-contradictions. It seems to be impossible to actually get anywhere with it.

What am I doing wrong here?

Re: OpenAI's fall from grace as investors race to Anthropic

#90

Post by nickstinemates »

phist_mcgee wrote: post #51
nickstinemates wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

that's why openai bought openclaw

I mean they hired the guy who created it. It's not exactly like openclaw is a real product.

Sure it is.. you can download and use it right now. Helps you understand why people are interested in it, at the very least.
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