Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

theatlantic.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 128 posts

Re: America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

#81

Post by pandaman »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #79
pandaman wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then back to the system defined in the Constitution, it gives enough guidance. If you think the President is not enough for the Executive - amend the Constitution, used to be enough for ~200 years though.

The Constitution does not define a civil service system . You seem to interpret that as saying that any system is unconstitutional until the Constitution is amended to define one. That is... let's just call it "very much a minority interpretation". We are not going to either amend the Constitution nor abolish the civil service just because some pseudonymous online account says we should.

The Constitution defines just three branches of power, if the "civil service system" has a power and is not one of the branches then it unconstitutional by common sense and elementary logic. And this "civil servant system" evidentially has power and is not a part of either of the three branches (which are all enumerated in the Constitution) ergo it's an unconstitutional junta.

>We are not going to either amend the Constitution nor abolish the civil service just because some pseudonymous online account says we should.

Did not you participate in the mass crying out on this very site when DOGE had been firing the "civil servants"?

Re: America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

#82

Post by didgetmaster »

jmyeet wrote: post #62
adventured wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The deep state is any agent of meaningful power/influence that works for the government or is very closely entangled with the government, and that retains some or all of their power/influence from one admin to the next. That includes for example powerful figures in the Pentagon or intelligence agencies that remain from one admin to the next. These people all have agendas of their own, and they network as people do. D…

There is this building where guys wearing masks wheel you into a room behind locked doors at dawn and then use drugs to knock you out. They then take sharp knives and cut you open and rummage around your insides, sometimes taking organs out. Blood goes everywhere. The footage is gory. When they're done with you it may takes you weeks to recover. The rest of just call his "surgery at a hospital". My point is that you'…

In my opinion a 'civil servant' sees their job as serving the American people to the best of their ability even if they don't agree with the outcomes of the latest election.

A member of the 'deep state'; however, is ideologically driven. If their favorite party is in power, they use their job to push their ideology to its limits. If the opposition party won the election; then they view their role as a means to 'resist', 'thwart', or otherwise delay any policies the elected officials try to implement.

Their general view is that their own opinions are superior to those of voters.

Re: America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

#83

Post by tim-projects »

exceptione wrote: post #49
bamboozled wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China has played much much better chess so it's not surprise they're benefiting. However, I don't really see how China will benefit from Iran being in ruins. Can you elaborate on how China benefits ? From what I can tell, The USA is either going for force a regime change or it's going to ruin Iran. Where will China get oil from then? You might say Russia but that's a precarious situation for them to be in.

> China has played much much better chess so it's not surprise they're benefiting. They didn't play chess at all, but unlike the USA, they didn't poop on the board and didn't smudge the other players with their drool. We are forgetting now that the belt and road initiative, as well as the wolf warrior diplomacy, had put China on the lowest rankings in global perception. China had to do literally nothing to "play bett…

Real life is not chess, and inaction is a valid move for the Chinese. Look up Wu Wei 'action without action'

Re: America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

#84

Post by quasse »

WarmWash wrote: post #10
adventured wrote: post #5

The single most interesting thing that will come out of the Iran war, is it's giving the go-ahead signal for China. I don't mean morally specifically, I mean practically: China is plainly seeing the US can't sustain a long campaign what-so-ever. The US has burned through ~850 Tomahawks in weeks, 20-25% of its stock. Again an opponent that wasn't that hard to knock down in terms of air to ground / ground to air, and s…

China's biggest hurdle that they cannot manufacture is experience. They have virtually zero. How much of China's military command is a crony boys club full of people who never had to militarily prove anything? Just "win" at their own made up war games?

> How much of China's military command is a crony boys club full of people who never had to militarily prove anything?

Have you even glanced at the current leadership of the US military?

Re: America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

#85

Post by jmyeet »

didgetmaster wrote: post #82
jmyeet wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is this building where guys wearing masks wheel you into a room behind locked doors at dawn and then use drugs to knock you out. They then take sharp knives and cut you open and rummage around your insides, sometimes taking organs out. Blood goes everywhere. The footage is gory. When they're done with you it may takes you weeks to recover. The rest of just call his "surgery at a hospital". My point is that you'…

In my opinion a 'civil servant' sees their job as serving the American people to the best of their ability even if they don't agree with the outcomes of the latest election. A member of the 'deep state'; however, is ideologically driven. If their favorite party is in power, they use their job to push their ideology to its limits. If the opposition party won the election; then they view their role as a means to 'resis…

I'm sorry but no. "Deep state" is nothing more than enemy within propaganda to justify a purge of government departments to replace them with ideologues and to further concentrate power in the hands of the so-called "unitary executive".

The point of my comment is that Republicans have this habit of describing perfectly ordinary and normal things in nefarious tones to make them sound sinister. The real problem is people are so gullible in falling for it.

Re: America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

#86

Post by bamboozled »

exceptione wrote: post #49
bamboozled wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China has played much much better chess so it's not surprise they're benefiting. However, I don't really see how China will benefit from Iran being in ruins. Can you elaborate on how China benefits ? From what I can tell, The USA is either going for force a regime change or it's going to ruin Iran. Where will China get oil from then? You might say Russia but that's a precarious situation for them to be in.

> China has played much much better chess so it's not surprise they're benefiting. They didn't play chess at all, but unlike the USA, they didn't poop on the board and didn't smudge the other players with their drool. We are forgetting now that the belt and road initiative, as well as the wolf warrior diplomacy, had put China on the lowest rankings in global perception. China had to do literally nothing to "play bett…

Let's say the USA does gain control over the Straight of Homuz, wouldn't that be quite an issue for China though? Where would it get it's oil from?

I don't agree with what's going on in Iran, I'm just thinking that regardless of whether or not it's a good idea, if the USA is basically in control of all meaningful oil exports, then it's game over for any significant Chinese military action because, they won't have the oil to run their aircraft carriers etc (they don't have nuclear carriers).

I think I understand their logic, but I might agree with others who say this is going to be an extremely bloody / unpopular war with very little justification for it's existence.

Re: America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

#87

Post by bamboozled »

monknomo wrote: post #37
bamboozled wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China has played much much better chess so it's not surprise they're benefiting. However, I don't really see how China will benefit from Iran being in ruins. Can you elaborate on how China benefits ? From what I can tell, The USA is either going for force a regime change or it's going to ruin Iran. Where will China get oil from then? You might say Russia but that's a precarious situation for them to be in.

china benefits from America eroding its global power is what the thesis is, I believe. Iran being a quagmire that erode's America's global power.

They're gambling basically, if it works and they do topple the regime, I think it will work for the USA, and if it turns into a prolonged quagmire, then yes, it will probably not be successful and very detrimental. I do sympathize with those who just wanted cheaper eggs.

Re: America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

#88

Post by [deleted] »

anakaine wrote: post #52
bamboozled wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China has played much much better chess so it's not surprise they're benefiting. However, I don't really see how China will benefit from Iran being in ruins. Can you elaborate on how China benefits ? From what I can tell, The USA is either going for force a regime change or it's going to ruin Iran. Where will China get oil from then? You might say Russia but that's a precarious situation for them to be in.

The Belt and Road initiative gets a shot in the arm. No tarrifs, free trade, lower cost finance with fewer encumbrances. Efforts to establish the Renminbi as a second reserve currency have been quiet, but these trade alliances and alternate banking arrangements are already making it a possible reality. US perception is that belt and road was unpopular and a failure, but its little different from US economic imperiali…

[deleted]

Re: America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

#89

Post by bamboozled »

jmyeet wrote: post #45
bamboozled wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China has played much much better chess so it's not surprise they're benefiting. However, I don't really see how China will benefit from Iran being in ruins. Can you elaborate on how China benefits ? From what I can tell, The USA is either going for force a regime change or it's going to ruin Iran. Where will China get oil from then? You might say Russia but that's a precarious situation for them to be in.

The US cannot ruin Iran short of the widespread use of nuclear weapons. Air power has never resulted in regime change. Never . It takes boots on the ground and one just needs to look at a map. Iran is surrounded on 3 sides by mountains and the Gulf on the fourth. Iran's drones and ballistic missiles are incredibly cheap, well-defended and impossible to meaningfully disrupt. The interceptors used to stop them are runn…

I read these comments and I almost wonder if it's just parroting of state sponsored stories. I'm personally not in support of what's going on in the middle east at all, but it does sounds like a fear campaign or something. As if Iran is some sort of unconquerable bastion that is untouchable. In my honest opinion, no one except fairly senior intelligence people would really know what's going on.

They have no air force left, no navy, realistically no way to defend any of their infrastructure, yet apparently, there is no way they can be undone?

What do you think the entire freaking world is going to do if their economies start failing because Iran is blocking the straight of Homuz? Will we all just die or will other countries get involved and start making sure it opens? Will the trillions of dollars the gulf states have just sit there idly while Iran ruins their ability to sell oil ? I don't think so. Right now I think Iran has some leverage, there is maybe even some sympathy directed their way, but in my view it's limited. People right now are unhappy about what the US did, and maybe blame them for high oil prices etc, but at some stage, if it's between Iran existing, and peoples ability to eat, I think I know which side people will choose.

I do worry something like this could really be the start of WW3 though because I don't think China will allow Iran to topple, so it's a precarious situation.

Right now, the question seems to be more about whether or not the neighbors are willing to take the hit, and whether or not the world will tolerate the economic devastation, not whether or not the USA can inflict a lot more damage.

Re: America Is Now a Rogue Superpower

#90

Post by thisisit »

gspetr wrote: post #57
anakaine wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who even is the deep state any more? MAGA was sure it was backroom democrats. Project 2025 has provided much of the playbook for this administrations run, and thats deep red conservative territory. Meanwhile we have an overwhelming body of evidence for market manipulation and extreme profit taking on the war and oil fronts, pointing to politically aligned financiers. I don't think the deep state is any discernible si…

> Who even is the deep state any more? The same thing it's always been: The military-industrial complex. > MAGA was sure it was backroom democrats. It's not that hard to distinguish "them", just look at how fast the mainstream media threw Biden under the bus over Afghanistan withdrawal. 1)POTUS orders the withdrawal. 2)Generals botch the withdrawal on purpose. 3)Mainstream media (left and right) eviscerates the POTUS…

It was Trump who made that deal to withdraw from Afghanistan by May 2021. Biden as POTUS followed through with some delays.

So, what was this about not being a bogeyman being conjured by right again?

Post reply on HN