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A pig's brain has been frozen with its cellular activity locked in place

newscientist.com

81–90 of 186 posts

Re: A pig's brain has been frozen with its cellular activity locked in place

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a citation for the notion they can modify their own DNA? I would fairly easily believe they can modify its expression, but I’m skeptical of the idea they can modify the sequence.

It is half true in that they can modify their epigenetics.

Right, that’s why it makes sense. And epigenetics are not changes to DNA sequences.

Re: A pig's brain has been frozen with its cellular activity locked in place

#82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The beauty of groundhog day is what we can accomplish when we have unlimited time and no real responsibilities People overemphasize the "time loop trap" piece but seem to overlook the fact that he eventually uses the time to better himself in almost every way. He's a much better, much more enriched and happy person by the end.

Groundhog day was perhaps the wrong phrase to use. In any case I don't believe people would spontaneously attempt meaningful self-improvement with any seriousness if there was no expected finality to our existence. Don't forget, Bill Murray's character has to kill himself numerous times before he makes any kind of worthwhile progress.

Another way of looking at it is that Bill Murray's character learns over and over that there are no consequences to failure.

The biggest thing holding people back imo is fear of failure, fear of consequences.

If your dream is starting a business but if it fails you'll be broke, it's understandable if you're hesitant

Fear of failure cripples people because setbacks are so costly. Many people never attempt anything because they are afraid they will fail. Or more accurately because they cannot afford to fail

Re: A pig's brain has been frozen with its cellular activity locked in place

#84

Here's a thought experiment. I offer you the chance to be put in a medically induced coma and shipped around the world to strangers you know nothing about. You don't know what economic, political, or moral system you'll awaken to. The only thing you know for sure is they, for some reason we're interested in receiving an unconscious person, no questions asked. Do you take the deal? Do you sign your family up for it?

The Bobiverse novels start this way. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_E._Taylor)

Re: A pig's brain has been frozen with its cellular activity locked in place

#85
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not that I think this is anywhere close in actuality, but It's reminding me of MMAcevedo. ( https://qntm.org/mmacevedo ) What server will I wake up on? Who is running the infrastructure? What will be asked of me to be allowed to continue to exist on that server? Given our current societal trends, I can't imagine I would enjoy any existence where a copy of me is spun back up. And of course, my original thread of consc…

You will not wake up on any server. At best possible theoretical far future scenario better or worse copy of yours will. If you would survive such process, you yourself, the human instance that wrote that will be just looking at somebody else living their now-fully-digital (prison) life. I don't understand why people don't get this simple fact. We are all gonna die, make inner peace with that (it isn't that hard, dep…

>We are all gonna die, make inner peace with that (it isn't that hard, depends mostly on your ego)

You should go to a cancer ward and tell that to all the cancer patients there. That will make them "get it" like you do.

Re: A pig's brain has been frozen with its cellular activity locked in place

#86
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not that I think this is anywhere close in actuality, but It's reminding me of MMAcevedo. ( https://qntm.org/mmacevedo ) What server will I wake up on? Who is running the infrastructure? What will be asked of me to be allowed to continue to exist on that server? Given our current societal trends, I can't imagine I would enjoy any existence where a copy of me is spun back up. And of course, my original thread of consc…

You will not wake up on any server. At best possible theoretical far future scenario better or worse copy of yours will. If you would survive such process, you yourself, the human instance that wrote that will be just looking at somebody else living their now-fully-digital (prison) life. I don't understand why people don't get this simple fact. We are all gonna die, make inner peace with that (it isn't that hard, dep…

>I don't understand why people don't get this simple fact.

Some people think identity and the continuity of consciousness are based on information or computation, and not on specific physical matter or soul-like constructs, so for them a transfer of all relevant information would constitute a transfer of consciousness and identity. From this perspective (leaving aside questions of practicality) "you yourself looking from the biological body at somebody else in the computer" is exactly as valid as "you yourself looking from inside the computer at somebody else in the biological body" (and in fact the whole idea that you have to choose one or the other as "the real you" becomes moot on this view).

Of course it's a difficult metaphysical conundrum but to say that your view of things is "a simple fact" when the basic scientific materialist worldview of today points at least as much in the opposite direction is a bit overconfident.

Re: A pig's brain has been frozen with its cellular activity locked in place

#87
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You will not wake up on any server. At best possible theoretical far future scenario better or worse copy of yours will. If you would survive such process, you yourself, the human instance that wrote that will be just looking at somebody else living their now-fully-digital (prison) life. I don't understand why people don't get this simple fact. We are all gonna die, make inner peace with that (it isn't that hard, dep…

> it isn't that hard, depends mostly on your ego This feels like an odd cope, sure I might not be able to do anything about my mortality, but I still view the fact that I and other people are mortal as a damn tragedy (and often the gradual decline and non-dignified end of people's lives). If someone held a gun at my head and I knew that within a minute they're going to pull the trigger, I'd be rightfully quite distur…

Most likely if you put a gun to his head and he'll beg for his life and stoop to do the most pathetic tasks to stay alive. It's not cope, more delusional arrogance.

Re: A pig's brain has been frozen with its cellular activity locked in place

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Groundhog day was perhaps the wrong phrase to use. In any case I don't believe people would spontaneously attempt meaningful self-improvement with any seriousness if there was no expected finality to our existence. Don't forget, Bill Murray's character has to kill himself numerous times before he makes any kind of worthwhile progress.

Another way of looking at it is that Bill Murray's character learns over and over that there are no consequences to failure. The biggest thing holding people back imo is fear of failure, fear of consequences. If your dream is starting a business but if it fails you'll be broke, it's understandable if you're hesitant Fear of failure cripples people because setbacks are so costly. Many people never attempt anything bec…

It's nice that a fictional character in a fictional scenario could come to such an understanding, but in real life there absolutely are consequences to failure, in a multitude of ways.

If you mean it in the sense that 'ultimately, nothing really matters', then the subtext to that is that nothing ultimately matters because we all die in the end. Which would be completely negated by immortality.

Re: A pig's brain has been frozen with its cellular activity locked in place

#89
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this scenario, the alternative is “you die”. Let’s make sure we’re including that in the question.

Brains 'R Us recently filed for chapter 11 and has been cut up and sold for scrap to private equity. The new PE firm has your brain. In 2208 there's a large grey market for brains to be used for hybrid AI and meat bag workflows. It's technically illegal in many jurisdictions due to "ethical implications", but is still the cheapest way to run many workloads. The method used to harness the brain involves reanimating it…

> grey market for brains to be used for hybrid AI and meat bag workflows ... is still the cheapest way to run many workloads.

It's an absolute nightmare scenario, but luckily it has become completely implausible since 2023. We're actually on a trajectory for human brains becoming the most expensive option for basically any job. Not saying this would make me comfortable with brain cloning, but at least the simple economic incentive seems to be gone.

Re: A pig's brain has been frozen with its cellular activity locked in place

#90
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You will not wake up on any server. At best possible theoretical far future scenario better or worse copy of yours will. If you would survive such process, you yourself, the human instance that wrote that will be just looking at somebody else living their now-fully-digital (prison) life. I don't understand why people don't get this simple fact. We are all gonna die, make inner peace with that (it isn't that hard, dep…

>We are all gonna die, make inner peace with that (it isn't that hard, depends mostly on your ego) You should go to a cancer ward and tell that to all the cancer patients there. That will make them "get it" like you do.

That doesn't mean you have to like the fact that you're dying. But make peace with the fact that you too, will die - it's one of the very few universal truths of life. I see so many people living like they are going to live forever - world would be a better place if more people realized that this isn't true, and your time on earth is limited.
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