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Java 26 is here

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Re: Java 26 is here

#81

Post by hocuspocus »

spockz wrote: post #72
gf000 wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They trade blows, and have different philosophies (complex runtime, simpler language vs the reverse). E.g. on the GC side Java is ahead of any other platform, especially with the low-latency ZGC garbage collector.

I would love to have a Java compiler with the capabilities of the .net compiler. To make incremental builds to aid code completion including type information, looking past simple syntactical errors, fixing them, and continuing compilation. Currently, this is “magic” embedded in eclipse, IntelliJ, and maybe a bit in the vscode plugin. Imagine having a Java LSP running that can provide all this information while typing…

Java LSP backends are basically headless Eclipse and NetBeans, they definitely go beyond syntactical errors.

There's also the upcoming Metals v2 that's using another compiler frontend optimized for performance, Google Turbine: https://metals-lsp.org

Actionable diagnostics for Java aren't implemented yet though.

Re: Java 26 is here

#82

Post by pjmlp »

dzonga wrote: post #37

the people that work on Java & the JVM are very smart. it has become a best of breed language - hell its better than Go for industry purposes. the drawback with Java will always be the CULTURE - (maybe someone can insert a quote of how in physics progress is only made, when old physicist die - I don't wanna be morbid ) but with Java same that's when the culture will change. All those people using typescript (could be…

Enterprise space architecture is not picky, all programming languages get a place when they manage to hit big at corporate life.

It can be Yourdon with C and Pascal, Booch with Smalltalk and C++, Patterns with Smalltalk and C++, UML with Ada, C++, Smalltalk and Java, Rational RUP , Java and .NET application servers, Kubernetes with WebAssembly microservices,....

Ever looked into Typescript with effects, pretending to be Haskell?

Re: Java 26 is here

#83

Post by zokier »

cess11 wrote: post #67
mands wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's getting better, it doesn't all have to be Spring Boot and JBoss. There is quarkus, helidon and micronaut for slimmer more modern backend frameworks. jbang for scripting (think uvx, bunx), Tambo UI ( https://tamboui.dev/ ) for terminal UIs, and more. Along with all the new Java features that help you write much simpler code - eg. virtual threads, structured concurrency, stream gatherers, and performance / resourc…

If someone reads this and wonders what JBoss is, the contemporary variety is called WildFly and it is actually rather easy to install and play around with. https://www.wildfly.org/ I think this is an often overlooked solution to some of the problems we nowadays tend to approach the clown for. As for build systems, Maven is old and cranky but if something else replaces it, it will probably be quite similar anyway.

> As for build systems, Maven is old and cranky but if something else replaces it, it will probably be quite similar anyway.

Bazel is the most obvious contender and very different from Maven in almost every possible way.

Re: Java 26 is here

#84

Post by pjmlp »

cyberax wrote: post #38
pjmlp wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They definitely did not, it was Android Java from day one, and Oracle should have crushed them like Sun did to Microsoft, unfortunately Google was the geek darling of do not evil, thus they got a pass from fanboys.

Android was not 100% compatible with Java, but mostly because it had a specialized environment. It did not support things like dynamic bytecode generation, but it faithfully reproduced pretty much everything else that made sense. And yeah, it would have been so much better with Oracle(tm)(r)(c)(fuckyou) running Android with Pure Java(tm)(r)(c)(screwyou) instead. Now with EJB5 and more XML! You might be too young to r…

My dear I am programming since 1986, and a Nokia alumni.

Re: Java 26 is here

#85

Post by zokier »

nradov wrote: post #74
HendrikHensen wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean by "better than Go for industry purposes"? I don't understand what "industry purposes" means and in what aspects Java is better than Go in your opinion (I can think of some myself, but I'm interested in your perspective).

Ya, that seems to be a misunderstanding. "Industry purposes" covers a huge range of stuff. Go is pretty good for systems programming where Java isn't really an option due to the fundamental limits imposed by garbage collection and lack of pointers. Java is pretty good for higher-level application development where occasional GC pauses are tolerable (the GC pauses are rare and fast now, but they still rule out using J…

Go has gc too and arguably worse one than Java

Re: Java 26 is here

#86

Post by geodel »

pjmlp wrote: post #34
cyberax wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google basically played a J++ with Android Java No, they didn't. Google happily used regular Java until Oracle played Oracle. Then Google stopped updating the supported Java language version and started diversifying away from Java.

They definitely did not, it was Android Java from day one, and Oracle should have crushed them like Sun did to Microsoft, unfortunately Google was the geek darling of do not evil, thus they got a pass from fanboys.

Oracle's Java Mobile Edition could've crushed Android. No one stopped them.

> Google was the geek darling of do not evil, thus they got a pass from fanboys.

Oracle's case against Google went all the way up to Supreme Court of US. Oracle did not win anything substantial in courts against Google is not fanboys' doing.

Re: Java 26 is here

#87

Post by zokier »

haolez wrote: post #4

I was pretty surprised when I learned recently that the Java alternative for green threads doesn't use colored functions. It put Java in a higher place in my perception.

It doesn't completely solve function coloring though. Causing carrier threads to get pinned is still not good, similarly as calling blocking function from async function is not good in colored systems.

Re: Java 26 is here

#88

Post by jillesvangurp »

oystersareyum wrote: post #66

Do changes to Java itself impact e.g. Clojure? I think it uses many java primitives instead of emitting jvm byte code but I can be wrong.

Some of the standard library stuff could be usable from Clojure and other languages. The jvm level optimizations (garbage collection) should benefit all jvm languages. The language changes are mostly not that relevant unless you program directly in Java.

I use Kotlin myself (after doing Java since 1995). Most of the overview here reads like they are adding a lot of stuff that Kotlin has had for many years. Structured concurrency, lazy stuff, etc. You can argue about which language does it better/nicer/etc. but that debate is a bit boring to me. But good for Java developers that they are getting some obviously useful things that so far they never had. Progress is nice. Better late than never.

Re: Java 26 is here

#89

Post by refulgentis »

dzonga wrote: post #37

the people that work on Java & the JVM are very smart. it has become a best of breed language - hell its better than Go for industry purposes. the drawback with Java will always be the CULTURE - (maybe someone can insert a quote of how in physics progress is only made, when old physicist die - I don't wanna be morbid ) but with Java same that's when the culture will change. All those people using typescript (could be…

Front page, 82 comments, comment 2 hours ago…why is this the top comment? “People who write Typescript could just be writing Java except they’re scared of being outcasts for not using design patterns” is bait, not a serious technical opinion.

Oh. That’s why it’s the top comment.

Re: Java 26 is here

#90

Post by einrealist »

I have been using Java since version 1.4. Both the language and its ecosystem have come a long way since then. I endured the height of the EJB phase. I adopted Spring when version 1.2 was released. I spent hours fighting with IDEs to run OSGi bundles. I hated building UIs with Swing/AWT, many of which are still in use today and are gradually being replaced by lovely JavaFX. When I look at code I wrote around 12 years ago, I'm amazed at how much I've matured too.
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