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New imagery suggests U.S. responsible for Iran school strike

cnn.com

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Re: New imagery suggests U.S. responsible for Iran school strike

#81

Post by petre »

lawn wrote: post #40
jiggawatts wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many similar incidents occurred in Ukraine, where Russia targeted apartment blocks that were built on the former site of some sort of military building that was demolished decades ago. The ultimate hubris is launching a multi million dollar missile to kill civilians because you couldn’t be bothered to check Google street view (or whatever).

Russia actively targets hospitals, fire departments and schools for years and you attribute it to "outdated info". Shame on you.

You forgot about churches and shopping malls.

Re: New imagery suggests U.S. responsible for Iran school strike

#82

Post by [deleted] »

surgical_fire wrote: post #74
vunderba wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I saw that interview I immediately thought, people like Hegseth are why treaties like the Geneva Convention were created in the first place.

People like Hegseth is why you sometimes need Nuremberg trials too.

[deleted]

Re: New imagery suggests U.S. responsible for Iran school strike

#83

Post by _alternator_ »

mrguyorama wrote: post #61
_alternator_ wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a tragic mistake like this was foreseeable (in a vague sense), but I highly doubt that anyone intentionally bombed an elementary school full of children. The NYT had some good reporting on this, and you can see how the mistake was made. The elementary school used to be part of the IRGC base until 2016. Then it was fenced off and made an elementary school. The “shooter” (in this case, the USA) had a duty to ch…

>but I highly doubt that anyone intentionally bombed an elementary school full of children Hegseth said to your face "No stupid rules of engagement", "This is not a politically correct war" These are the people who have been purposely and loudly defending Israel bombing innocent people. They genuinely believe, as they say to your face, that it is important and necessary to be brutal and extreme to win war. Intentiona…

Trust me, I’m not trying to defend the leadership of the DoW. But I do believe that there is a difference between reckless indifference and actually intentionally bombing a girls school.

Both sound like war crimes to me, but the latter sounds implausible given the known facts. Let’s not redefine words like ‘intentional’ just because we are appalled. Giving something awful an “awfuller” name is not going to help.

Re: New imagery suggests U.S. responsible for Iran school strike

#85

Post by jiggawatts »

lawn wrote: post #80
jiggawatts wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh sure, and the US did it against both Japan and Germany in WW2, but those were not even remotely the same scenario as precision strikes against the IRGC and Iranian leadership in general. This was clearly a horrific mistake, especially obvious since the girls school used to be a military building.

I was talking about Russia, not US incompetence or malice, who have an explicit tactic to target civilians.

They target civilian infrastructure like power plants and the like, but again, that's "not the same" as purposefully targeting a school or an apartment block. The latter they do fairly clearly by accident, because I've seen at least four video clips of Ukranians interviewed outside of a bombed civilian building saying something to the effect of "Oh yeah, back in 1990 there was a military training facility here but it was demolished in `91."

Note that 1991 was the year Ukraine and Russia split and Russia stopped getting a "direct feed" of things like urban planning information from Kiev.

Re: New imagery suggests U.S. responsible for Iran school strike

#86

Post by Herring »

LightBug1 wrote: post #75
plaidfuji wrote: post #47

If this turns out to be true, which seems increasingly likely day by day, this will be the humanitarian price against which the rest of the campaign will be measured. The US will have ceded much of the moral high ground they claimed in avenging the slaughter of innocent protesters.

Can't cede moral high ground when that moral high ground is a claim no one believes in anymore. If they ever did.

It’s basically like North Korea calling itself “democratic peoples republic”. Just roll your eyes and move on.

Re: New imagery suggests U.S. responsible for Iran school strike

#87

Post by ryandrake »

surgical_fire wrote: post #70
SauntSolaire wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disagree, negligence seems more likely

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/hegseth-insists-the-iran-... "No stupid rules of engagement, no nation building quagmire, no democracy building exercise, no politically correct wars. We fight to win, and we don't waste time or lives," Hegseth said. Words of your Secretary of War, not mine. This is not a woke war. This is a war where you bomb schools and kill children.

The ridiculous renaming to "Department of War" supports this attitude, as well. They're declaring to everyone our intent to be belligerents. That the US military is meant to be aggressors and instigators, rather than defenders. All signs point to an administration bent on aggression and destruction.

I mean, to be fair, the US always has been the instigators, but it's now official, something this administration is proud of.

Re: New imagery suggests U.S. responsible for Iran school strike

#88

Post by jiggawatts »

krapp wrote: post #77
jiggawatts wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was quite obviously outdated info. What people don’t seem to understand is the word “targeted”. They see some obviously civilian target in ruins with screaming parents outside and they have an instant visceral emotional reaction: “What kind of monster would do something like this on purpose!?” Practically nobody targets civilian building with expensive precision munitions! They’re expensive! There’s limited supply…

>Practically nobody targets civilian building with expensive precision munitions! They’re expensive! There’s limited supply! Targets are chosen to maximise the military effect. We're not dealing with a rational or competent military chain of command. We're dealing with people who believe they're bringing about the Biblical Second Coming and that rules of engagement are "woke." These are literally cartoonishly evil pe…

I'm going to confidently state that nobody in the US military chain of command gave the order to "mix some schools into the target list" for any reason, religious or not.

That's absurd on its face, and if you honestly believe that, then your mental model of how the world (and people in general) function is fundamentally broken.

Re: New imagery suggests U.S. responsible for Iran school strike

#89

Post by krapp »

jiggawatts wrote: post #88
krapp wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Practically nobody targets civilian building with expensive precision munitions! They’re expensive! There’s limited supply! Targets are chosen to maximise the military effect. We're not dealing with a rational or competent military chain of command. We're dealing with people who believe they're bringing about the Biblical Second Coming and that rules of engagement are "woke." These are literally cartoonishly evil pe…

I'm going to confidently state that nobody in the US military chain of command gave the order to "mix some schools into the target list" for any reason, religious or not. That's absurd on its face, and if you honestly believe that, then your mental model of how the world (and people in general) function is fundamentally broken.

>That's absurd on its face, and if you honestly believe that, then your mental model of how the world (and people in general) function is fundamentally broken.

I'm not talking about the world or people in general, I'm talking about about the Commander in Chief Donald Trump and "Secretary of War" Pete Hegseth, the people who set the tone and make the decisions. And if you listen to either one of them, especially Hegseth, you'll realize it isn't absurd on its face at all.

Even if no one gave a specific order to "mix some schools into the target list" this administration clearly and explicitly - as in, has literally stated on the record - does not care about morality, ethics, rules of engagement or anything of the sort. It's not out of the question that they would intentionally target civilian infrastructure just as a show of force and aggression, or simply not care because their goal is and I'm quoting here "killing people and breaking things."

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