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MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

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Re: MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

#81

Post by MrDarcy »

re wrote: post #66
awesan wrote: post #5

It's nice that people are taking this up, and one of the main benefits of open source in the first place. I have my doubts that this will succeed if it's just one guy, but maybe it takes on new life this way and I would never discourage people from trying to add value to this world. That said I increasingly have a very strong distaste of these AI generated articles. They are long and tedious to read and it really mak…

> it really makes me doubt that what is written there is actually true at all Indeed, the whole "Ironically, switching from Apache 2.0 to AGPL irrevocably makes the project forkable" section seems misguided. Apache 2.0-licensed software is just as forkable.

The point being we can simply tell our agents to start at the rug pull point and implement the same features and bug fixes on the Apache fork referring to the AGPL implementation.

Re: MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

#82

Post by bigiain »

awesan wrote: post #5

It's nice that people are taking this up, and one of the main benefits of open source in the first place. I have my doubts that this will succeed if it's just one guy, but maybe it takes on new life this way and I would never discourage people from trying to add value to this world. That said I increasingly have a very strong distaste of these AI generated articles. They are long and tedious to read and it really mak…

> I have my doubts that this will succeed if it's just one guy

Normally, I'd agree with you 100%.

But there are some interesting mitigating circumstances here.

1) It's "just one guy" who's running a fairly complex open source project already, one which uses minio.

2) The stated intention is that the software is considered "finished" with no plans to add any features, so the maintenance burden is arguably way lower than typical open source projects (or forks)

3) they're quite open about using AI to maintain it - and like it or hate it, this "finding and helping fix bugs in complex codebases" seems to be an area where current AI is pretty good.

I'm sure a lot of people will be put off by the forker being Chinese, but honestly, from outside the US right now, it's unclear if Chinese or American software is a more existential risk.

I'll admit I'd never heard of their Pigsty project before, but a quick peek at their github shows a project that's been around for 5 years already, and has pull requests from over a dozen contributors. That's no guarantee this isn't just a better prepared Jia Tan zx utils supply chain attack, but at least it's clearly not just something that's all been created by one person over 2 or 12 months.

Re: MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

#83

Post by rcxdude »

ekjhgkejhgk wrote: post #70

> Once code is released under AGPL, the license is irrevocable. You can set a repo to read-only, but you can’t claw back a granted license. > That’s the beauty of open-source licensing by design: a company can abandon a project, but it can’t take the code with it. This is a FREE license, which is not just open source. It's open source + more.

This statement is true of both open-source (by the OSI definition, which is a superset of free software by the FSF's definition) and free software. In fact, the fact that the original company could take their AGPL licensed software and make further updates proprietary is kind of a bug as far as the FSF is concerned (due to how copyright works and the fact that CLAs are a thing).

Re: MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

#84

Post by bigiain »

doctorpangloss wrote: post #77
bugufu8f83 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I agree completely. I know everyone is tired of AI accusations but this article has all of the telltale signs of LLM writing over and over again. I mean, I'm more worried about the AI writing itself than people calling it out. The AI articles on HN are an absolute disease. Just write your own damn articles if you're asking the rest of us to read them.

@dang what do you think? Is it a disease? People who make interesting conversation will tune out.

I'm not Dang, but I agree AI articles are a disease - but with reservations.

In this case, a Chinese developer who's not a native English speaker - I feel is _adding_ to "interesting conversations" not detracting from them but using AI assistance to publish an article like this in readable/understandable English.

I know HN and Ycombinator is _hugely_ US focused and secondarily English-speaking focused. But there's more and more interest in non US based "intellectual curiosity" where the original source material is not in English. From YC's capitalism-driven focus, they largely don't care. From my personal hacker ethic curiosity, I'd hate to miss out on articles like this just because of a prejudice against non English speakers who use AI to provide me with understandable versions.

Having said that, AI hype in general certainly feels like a disease to me. I was noting recently how the percentage of homepage like/discussions I click has gone way down. I remember the days where I'd click and read 80 or 90% of the things that made it to the homepage. These days I eyeroll my way past probably 2/3rds of them because they look at first glance (and from recent experience>) to just be AI hype in one form or another. (I've actually considered building myself a tool that'd grab the first three or so pages and then filter out everything AI related - but the other option is just to visit less often...)

Re: MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

#85

Post by nine_k »

Macha wrote: post #32
throawayonthe wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the FSF position is that GPL is unenforceable without a single copyright owner, which is why almost all gnu projects, linux, canonical/redhat/etc projects have a CLA or something functionally similar

That would seem a bizarre position from the FSF, since it would make the license on combined GPL works unenforceable. Do you have a source for that?

GPL maternally depends on copyright enforcement. Who would sue if an infringement is detected? All the contributors collectively?

Re: MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

#86

Post by bugufu8f83 »

bigiain wrote: post #84
doctorpangloss wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

@dang what do you think? Is it a disease? People who make interesting conversation will tune out.

I'm not Dang, but I agree AI articles are a disease - but with reservations. In this case, a Chinese developer who's not a native English speaker - I feel is _adding_ to "interesting conversations" not detracting from them but using AI assistance to publish an article like this in readable/understandable English. I know HN and Ycombinator is _hugely_ US focused and secondarily English-speaking focused. But there's mo…

I'm all for people who aren't native English speakers publishing their thoughts and opinions. But I would much prefer they still wrote down their own thoughts in their own words in their native language and machine translated it. It would be much more authentic and much more interesting--and much more worth reading.

Re: MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

#87

Post by mahkeiro »

bugufu8f83 wrote: post #86
bigiain wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not Dang, but I agree AI articles are a disease - but with reservations. In this case, a Chinese developer who's not a native English speaker - I feel is _adding_ to "interesting conversations" not detracting from them but using AI assistance to publish an article like this in readable/understandable English. I know HN and Ycombinator is _hugely_ US focused and secondarily English-speaking focused. But there's mo…

I'm all for people who aren't native English speakers publishing their thoughts and opinions. But I would much prefer they still wrote down their own thoughts in their own words in their native language and machine translated it. It would be much more authentic and much more interesting--and much more worth reading.

I'm not sure, based on past experiences people are complaining a lot about automatically translated text...

Re: MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

#88

Post by awesan »

skybrian wrote: post #79
awesan wrote: post #5

It's nice that people are taking this up, and one of the main benefits of open source in the first place. I have my doubts that this will succeed if it's just one guy, but maybe it takes on new life this way and I would never discourage people from trying to add value to this world. That said I increasingly have a very strong distaste of these AI generated articles. They are long and tedious to read and it really mak…

At this point the complaints about AI-written articles are worse than the articles. It's like nit-picking about bad kerning. Focus on the content.

I am sorry about that. What I am saying is that it's hard to trust the content given the context. And more so these articles are extremely verbose with a lot of BS in them, so it makes getting to the "content" a lot more work for me.

In any case I had one paragraph about the content and one side-note about the writing style. Every single reply except one focused on the side-note, including you.

Re: MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

#89

Post by throawayonthe »

Macha wrote: post #32
throawayonthe wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the FSF position is that GPL is unenforceable without a single copyright owner, which is why almost all gnu projects, linux, canonical/redhat/etc projects have a CLA or something functionally similar

That would seem a bizarre position from the FSF, since it would make the license on combined GPL works unenforceable. Do you have a source for that?

main point is expressed here i think: https://www.gnu.org/licenses/why-assign.html

but also seems i was mistaken about the status of linux copyright, they actually do have distributed copyright, apologies

Re: MinIO Is Dead, Long Live MinIO

#90

Post by Macha »

nine_k wrote: post #85
Macha wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would seem a bizarre position from the FSF, since it would make the license on combined GPL works unenforceable. Do you have a source for that?

GPL maternally depends on copyright enforcement. Who would sue if an infringement is detected? All the contributors collectively?

As with a lot of the past Linux based enforcements of the GPL, any of the contributors
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