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ASML unveils EUV light source advance that could yield 50% more chips by 2030

reuters.com

81–90 of 111 posts

Re: ASML unveils EUV light source advance that could yield 50% more chips by 2030

#81

So how small are individual components (e.g., transistors) nowadays? Presumably there's a lower limit: once you're a few atoms across, it seems that you can't go any smaller (?).

Gates are about 30-50 nm wide, even though they're called '3nm' for marketing reasons.

As The Register used to call it, these clean-sounding process nodes (15nm, 5nm, 3nm etc) are "marchitecture." Marketing architecture. Reality is much messier.

Re: ASML unveils EUV light source advance that could yield 50% more chips by 2030

#83
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is such a thing as X-ray lithography, but it comes with significant challenges that make it not really worth it compared to EUV.

I'd like to hear more about these challenges

There are no normal x-ray mirrors. The only way to focus them is to use special grazing mirrors where the x-rays hit them almost parallel to the surface.

https://science.gsfc.nasa.gov/662/instruments/mirrorlab/xopt...

Re: ASML unveils EUV light source advance that could yield 50% more chips by 2030

#84

Why this is a big deal: Right now the only way to make "bright" EUV (100-200 watts) is to spray fine drops of a metal in a stream, then target and blast each drop with a laser. pretty wild way to make light.

And they’re now going to hit each drop three! times instead of two, and increase to 100,000 drops per second. Very hard to imagine.

Re: ASML unveils EUV light source advance that could yield 50% more chips by 2030

#86
post #71
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have shares in one of their biggest customers, and one of their customer’s biggest customers. We are quickly leaving the realm of dependent variables still looking anything like diversification.

It seems like you want someone to ask you what the two companies are. So - what are the two companies?

Nvidia and an AI company

Re: ASML unveils EUV light source advance that could yield 50% more chips by 2030

#87
End result: the AI industry will get 50% more chips, the rest of us plebs will still be waiting for new GPUs to hit the market...

It's impressive to see that there still was so much room left to improve EUV, but I can't help but be royally pissed off that it will be a looooong time before we the people see any practical benefit of it.

Re: ASML unveils EUV light source advance that could yield 50% more chips by 2030

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing I didn't understand after watching that video was why you need such an exotic solution to produce EUV light. We can make lights no problem in the visible spectrum, we can make xray machines easily enough that every doctors office can afford one, what is it specifically about those wavelengths that are so tricky.

The issue isn't in generating short wavelength light, it's in focusing it accurately enough to print a pattern with trillions of nanoscale features with few defects. We can't really use lenses since every material we could use is opaque to high energy photons so we need to use mirrors, which still absorb a lot of the light energy hitting them. Now this only explains why we need all the crazy stuff that asml puts in i…

Photoresist too. XRays are really good at passing through matter, which is a bit of a problem when the whole goal is for them to be absorbed by a 100 nanometer thick film. They tend to ionize stuff, which is actually a mechanism for resist development, but XRay energies are high enough that the reactions become less predictable. They can knock electrons into neighboring resist regions or even knock them out of the material altogether.

Re: ASML unveils EUV light source advance that could yield 50% more chips by 2030

#89
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ITs easy to make X-rays, you just hit a metal target with electrons: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-ray_tube

You can hit metal the same way for EUV.

No you can't, or rather you only get a tiny amount in the correct wavelengths

Re: ASML unveils EUV light source advance that could yield 50% more chips by 2030

#90

Why this is a big deal: Right now the only way to make "bright" EUV (100-200 watts) is to spray fine drops of a metal in a stream, then target and blast each drop with a laser. pretty wild way to make light.

And they’re now going to hit each drop three! times instead of two, and increase to 100,000 drops per second. Very hard to imagine.

If you wrote a science fiction novel around the idea that we make computing devices by blasting fine drops of tin in a vacuum with a laser exactly 3 times at exactly 100,000 drops per second, nobody would believe it. Truth is crazier than fiction.
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