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The EU moves to kill infinite scrolling

politico.eu

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Re: The EU moves to kill infinite scrolling

#81

Post by avaer »

I admire the EU's attempts at things like the cookie law, age verification, and tackling the addictiveness of infinite scrolling, but the implementation is pure theater.

Trackers have much more effective techniques than "cookies", kids trivially bypass verification, and designers will make a joke of tell me you have infinite scrolling without telling me you have infinite scrolling. When you are facing trillions of dollars of competition to your law, what do you think is going to happen?

Maybe if there was an independent commission that had the authority to rapidly investigate and punish (i.e. within weeks) big tech for attempting engagement engineering practices it might actually have some effect. But trying to mandate end user interfaces is wasting everyone's time putting lipstick on a pig.

Re: The EU moves to kill infinite scrolling

#82

Post by happytoexplain »

linuxdude314 wrote: post #7

[flagged]

>Why would anyone care about something like this to the degree they feel like expressing the opinion publicly

Why would anyone publicly express any negative opinion about the effects of doomscrolling? I don't think I'm uncharitably paraphrasing, right?

Re: The EU moves to kill infinite scrolling

#83

Post by rendx »

rpdillon wrote: post #35
stephenr wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> even to know whether they've visited the site before So uh, don't do that. You don't need to notify if you use cookies for required functionality like login sessions or remembering a functional setting. If you're tracking whether they're returning or not your activity is exactly the kind of behaviour the rule is covering because, in legal terms, it's skeezy as fuck.

It's a site where they log in and we store a cookie.

"Strictly necessary cookies — These cookies are essential for you to browse the website and use its features, such as accessing secure areas of the site. Cookies that allow web shops to hold your items in your cart while you are shopping online are an example of strictly necessary cookies. These cookies will generally be first-party session cookies. While it is not required to obtain consent for these cookies, what they do and why they are necessary should be explained to the user."

https://gdpr.eu/cookies/

Re: The EU moves to kill infinite scrolling

#84

Post by puppycodes »

Facinating that they landed on infinite scrolling as the problem to spend time and energy on instead of all the other things happening online that have an impact on society.

Genuinely curious about the actual data on this.

Does anyone have a link to a reputable, sizable study?

Re: The EU moves to kill infinite scrolling

#86

Post by somewhereoutth »

Infinite scrolling combined with the algorithmic feed is the real nasty.

Feeds should be heavily regulated, effectively they are a (personalized!) broadcast, and maybe the same strictures should apply. Definitely they should be transparent (e.g. chronological from subscribed topics), and things like veering more extreme in order to drive engagement should be outlawed.

Re: The EU moves to kill infinite scrolling

#87

Post by kuerbel »

PlatoIsADisease wrote: post #21

I have a proud European coworker trying to get their H1B... They talk about how great Europe is, how they like their 1-2 hour coffee/smoke breaks... These kind of moves give me that same vibe. But why are so many Europeans trying to move to the US? Why isn't the opposite happening? My hypothesis is that these kind of popular policies are short sighted. They are super popular, they use intuition and feeling. But maybe…

Well, your freeeeedooooms include having to pay taxes when living outside of the US. I'd say that's a pretty big factor in deciding if it's worth it to leave the country.

Re: The EU moves to kill infinite scrolling

#88

Post by ben_w »

rockskon wrote: post #48
Forgeties79 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He’s not equating all addictions beyond saying they are all addictions and should be treated as such.

But that's the problem - different substances require different solutions. You reduce sugar intake, not eliminate it. You eliminate cocaine intake, not just reduce it. Treating social media design as equal to something that can kill people in excess unnerves me.

> Treating social media design as equal to something that can kill people in excess unnerves me.

As it should, because there's a really obvious "slippery slope" argument right there.

But… it can kill people.

There is a certain fraction of the population who, for whatever reason, can be manipulated, to the point of becoming killers or of causing injury to themselves. Social media… actually, worse than that, all A/B testing everywhere, can stumble upon this even when it isn't trying to (I would like to believe that OpenAI's experience with 4o-induced psychosis was unintentional).

When we know which tools can be used for manipulation, it's bad to keep allowing it to run unchecked. Unchecked, they are the tool of propagandists.

But… I see that slippery slope, I know that any government which successfully argues itself the power to regulate this, even for good, is one bad election away from a dictatorship that will abuse the same reasoning and powers to evil ends.

Re: The EU moves to kill infinite scrolling

#89

Post by kelseyfrog »

tokyobreakfast wrote: post #76
kelseyfrog wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drug stores should stock morphine available without age restriction and if you don't want it, just don't buy it.

[flagged]

Yes. The amount of emotional deregulation apparent in your response only advances my point.

Re: The EU moves to kill infinite scrolling

#90

Post by idle_zealot »

causalmodels wrote: post #72

Does this only apply to companies the commission doesn't like or will it apply to the hn app I use, my email clients, shopping sites, etc? Because it seems like the actual concern how good the algorithms are and not the UI.

This is a finding of a violation of the DSA, which only applies to services (not local reader apps), and only if they have a lot of users.

Like, a significant fraction of the country level of usage. You don't need to worry about the EU coming and taking away your HN client APK. You do need to be worried about Google doing that, though.

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