Facebook, I want my friends back • Hacker News Board

Re: Facebook, I want my friends back

#81

Post by tensor » Wed, Oct 24, 2012, 7:21 PM UTC

jrockway wrote: post #42

If I'm reading this correctly, the problem is that something that the author thinks should be free costs money, so Facebook is now "demanding that a $365 million dollar ransom gets collected from all the Mom & Pop businesses who use Facebook." Uh huh. "Mom & Pop business" seems to be the new "won't somebody please think of the children" line designed to extinguish all rational thought. I'm getting a little tired of i…

You talk about rational thought, but then go off on a tangent hoping all small business disappears? I'm curious what has made you so hateful towards both people who hold some ideal (that you don't share), and towards small businesses.

In particular, the best restaurants in the world are small, not chains. Chains are always mediocre by their very nature. Unlike in software, which can be replicated and exported perfectly, restaurants are about their chefs, something you cannot easily replicate and export. Even small finer dining chains vary hugely by location.

Re: Facebook, I want my friends back

#82

Post by code_duck » Wed, Oct 24, 2012, 7:25 PM UTC

Absolutely - I find the utility of Facebook vastly decreased by the fact that my News Feed is so heavily filtered, automatically, and poorly. I want to see everything by everyone on my friends list. I do not want some algorithm to go through and decide what it thinks I'm interested in, because it is wrong.

That's about my consumption. On the other end, I have a friend, an artist with 5,000+ friends. He told me that the engagement on his posts dropped drastically, from like 200-300 'likes' per photo to something like 20 earlier this year, and as such he's considering not bothering to use the site any longer. Apparently Facebook thinks those people aren't interested in his content? Or they want him to start paying. That isn't going to happen.

Re: Facebook, I want my friends back

#83

Post by thetrumanshow » Wed, Oct 24, 2012, 7:27 PM UTC

Interesting that Facebook has quietly evolved into what is basically an alternative for email list marketing. On the plus side, they are effectively training businesses to see the value of such things. Given that a certain % of those folks aren't going to want to pay Facebook due to their bait and switch tactics, I would expect companies like Constant Contact to be sitting on the verge of another round of explosive growth.

Re: Facebook, I want my friends back

#84

Post by caster_cp » Wed, Oct 24, 2012, 7:27 PM UTC

chaz wrote: post #28

If you're posting 10-16 posts a day and you forcibly put each of these into 100% of your fans, you're going to shrink your base. If you did that to me, I'm going to hide or Unlike your page. If you emailed me those posts, I'd be hitting unsubscribe in half a day. The Facebook News Feed isn't an RSS reader, and the Like button isn't Subscribe. I would suggest just posting once a day, and using the Promoted Posts for t…

That's the first thing I thought when I read the post. I was against Facebook's position at the beginning, but now I'm really glad they are charging that fee.

Besides that, Facebook is not the channel for you to get that ammount of data to your users. Facebook is a SOCIAL network, not a brand catalog. If they let that abusive behavior happen freely(sorry, but 16 posts a day is abusive behavior at least to me) their own product would be defaced.

Re: Facebook, I want my friends back

#85

Post by Lasher » Wed, Oct 24, 2012, 7:29 PM UTC

This doesn't make sense to me as a user or as a page admin.

As a user, if my friends post something I want to see it. If my daughter's karate school or my favorite band posts something, I want to see it. If they're spammy, I'll unsubscribe. I would like to make this decision for myself, not have it made for me. If it has to be made for me, I would prefer it be made based on some approximation of relevance and quality, not because someone paid $5 to spam me with it.

As an advertiser, Facebook has consistently promoted ads as a way to build a following via the 'like' button. So I pay Facebook to gain exposure to build a following of 10,000 fans and now I have to pay again if I want to reach them all?? Classic bait and switch. I wonder how many past advertisers would have paid to build up their 'likes' if they had been told very clearly up front "Just because someone likes your page does not mean they will see your posts in their news feed".

Re: Facebook, I want my friends back

#86

Post by bravoyankee » Wed, Oct 24, 2012, 7:30 PM UTC

If you're posting 10-16 times a day on Facebook, you probably don't have any friends. That's waaay too much.

Re: Facebook, I want my friends back

#87

Post by code_duck » Wed, Oct 24, 2012, 7:30 PM UTC

DanBC wrote: post #19

> At Dangerous Minds, we post anywhere from 10 to 16 items per day, fewer on the weekends. This is why I don't like many pages, and it's why FB needs clear and easy to use controls for what does or doesn't show up on my wall.

I think you mean 'News Feed', not 'wall'. Wall is the old name for your page. They are now called Timelines.

Re: Facebook, I want my friends back

#88

Post by scott_s » Wed, Oct 24, 2012, 7:32 PM UTC

ry0ohki wrote: post #58

chaz wrote: post #28

If you're posting 10-16 posts a day and you forcibly put each of these into 100% of your fans, you're going to shrink your base. If you did that to me, I'm going to hide or Unlike your page. If you emailed me those posts, I'd be hitting unsubscribe in half a day. The Facebook News Feed isn't an RSS reader, and the Like button isn't Subscribe. I would suggest just posting once a day, and using the Promoted Posts for t…

So what? Annoying pages can get un-liked, and the problem will work itself out. But if someone is a "Fan" of the brand and wants to see all of their 15 posts in a day, it's frustrating they can't. The default in Facebook is always "Most Popular", and even when I change it to "Most Recent" (to see the long tail of my friends activities, since I don't trust Facebook), Facebook always sets it back.

As a rule, I don't "Like" sites, but I was unaware that it actually meant "subscribe me to this."

Re: Facebook, I want my friends back

#89

Post by MartinCron » Wed, Oct 24, 2012, 7:36 PM UTC

tedunangst wrote: post #80

tocomment wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious why you think they should be out of business.

You can find better selection, better prices, and better advice on the Internet. Also, Jeff bezos doesn't give me the "I hate young people" stink eye when I browse his store. The local hardware store opens at 9:00am. Or 9:30. Or whenever pop finishes his breakfast. Because whatever I have planned for the day is not nearly as urgent as his crossword puzzle. That shit doesn't happen at Home Depot.

Home Depot (Starbucks, Applebee's, whatever) set both a floor and a ceiling for expectation of quality. For every crappy mom and pop hardware store that is poorly run, there is also an independent hardware store with kind and helpful people.

When I am traveling, I will go to Starbucks, but in my city, I know where the exceptional coffee is.

edit: s/privacy/quality

Re: Facebook, I want my friends back

#90

Post by scott_meade » Wed, Oct 24, 2012, 7:37 PM UTC

"But I can’t pay them $2000 a day and $672,000 a year for the exact same product that I was getting for free back in March!"

Another in a long, long list of customers whose plans fall apart when a free or one-price-for-life service realizes it cannot continue with business as usual. Today's pro tip: Do not build your livelihood around a third-party's free service. Eventually that service will either 1.) shut down, 2.) kick you out of their ecosystem, or 3.) start charging you.

I'm not sure what is more surprising: that people continue to build businesses with these Achilles heels or that they seem shocked when the third-party changes the game.