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The Waymo World Model

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Re: The Waymo World Model

#81

Post by bragr »

breckinloggins wrote: post #55
PeterStuer wrote: post #38

Imagine driving in a Waymo 'out of a raging fire'. Talk about edge cases. But, what would you do? Trust the Waymo, or get out (or never get in) at the first sign of trouble?

Interesting question. If the Waymo was driving aggressively to remove us from the situation but relatively safely I might stay in it. This does bring up something, though: Waymo has a "pull over" feature, but it's hidden behind a couple of touch screen actions involving small virtual buttons and it does not pull over immediately. Instead, it "finds a spot to pull over". I would very much like a big red STOP IMMEDIATE…

>it's hidden behind a couple of touch screen actions involving small virtual buttons and it does not pull over immediately

It was on the home screen when I've taken it, and when I tested it, it seemed to pull to the first safe place. I don't trust the general pubic with a stop button.

Re: The Waymo World Model

#82

Post by FL33TW00D »

Kapura wrote: post #74

Interesting that this should come out right as lawmakers are beginning to understand that Waymos have overseas operators making major decisions. [*] https://futurism.com/advanced-transport/waymos-controlled-wo...

Completely false: https://x.com/i/status/2019213765506670738

Listen to the statement.

The operators help when the Waymo is in a "difficult situation".

Car drives itself 99% of the time, long tail of issues not yet fixed have a human intervene.

Everyone is making out like it's an RC car, completely false.

Re: The Waymo World Model

#83

Post by runarberg »

sekai wrote: post #72
runarberg wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Autonomous private cars is not the technological progress you think it is. We’ve had autonomous trains for decades, and while it provides us with a more efficient and cost effective public transit system, it didn’t open the doors for the next revolutionary technology. Self driving cars is a dead end technology, that will introduce a whole host of new problems which are already solved with public transit, better urban…

> We’ve had autonomous trains for decades Trains need tracks, cars - already have the infrastructure to drive on. > Self driving cars is a dead end technology, that will introduce a whole host of new problems which are already solved with public transit, better urban planning, etc. Self driving cars will literally become a part of public transit

> Self driving cars will literally become a part of public transit

I’ve been hearing people say that for almost 15 years now. I believe it when I see it.

Re: The Waymo World Model

#84

Post by tfehring »

smallmancontrov wrote: post #21
bonsai_spool wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think I'm misunderstanding - they're converting video into their representation which was bootstrapped with LIDAR, video and other sensors. I feel you're alluding to Tesla, but Tesla could never have this outcome since they never had a LIDAR phase. (edit - I'm referring to deployed Tesla vehicles, I don't know what their research fleet comprises, but other commenters explain that this fleet does collect LIDAR)

They can and they do. https://youtu.be/LFh9GAzHg1c?t=872 They've also built it into a full neural simulator. https://youtu.be/LFh9GAzHg1c?t=1063 I think what we are seeing is that they both converged on the correct approach, one of them decided to talk about it, and it triggered disclosure all around since nobody wants to be seen as lagging.

I watched that video around both timestamps and didn't see or hear any mention of LIDAR, only of video.

Re: The Waymo World Model

#85

Post by jmux »

menaerus wrote: post #49
ActorNightly wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The purpose of lidar is to prove error correction when you need it most in terms of camera accuracy loss. Humans do this, just in the sense of depth perception with both eyes.

How expensive is their lidar system?

Waymo does their LiDAR in-house, so unfortunately we don’t know the specs or the cost

Re: The Waymo World Model

#86

Post by runarberg »

pnut wrote: post #70
runarberg wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Autonomous private cars is not the technological progress you think it is. We’ve had autonomous trains for decades, and while it provides us with a more efficient and cost effective public transit system, it didn’t open the doors for the next revolutionary technology. Self driving cars is a dead end technology, that will introduce a whole host of new problems which are already solved with public transit, better urban…

Nope. Humans are statistically fallible and their attention is too valuable to be obliged to a mundane task like executing navigation commands. Redesigning and rebuilding city transportation infrastructure isn't happening, look around. Also personal agency limits public transportation as a solution.

Unlike autonomous driving, public transit is a proven solution employed in thousands of cities around the world, on various scales, economies, etc.

> Redesigning and rebuilding city transportation infrastructure isn't happening, look around.

We have been redesigning and rebuilding city transportation infrastructure since we had cities. Where I live (Seattle) they are opening a new light rail bridge crossing just next month (first rail over a floting bridge; which is technologically very interesting), and two new rail lines are being planned. In the 1960s the Bay area completely revolutionized their transit sytem when they opened BART.

I think you are simply wrong here.

Re: The Waymo World Model

#88

Post by bragr »

hangonhn wrote: post #62
menaerus wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How expensive is their lidar system?

Hesai has driven the cost into the $200 to 400 range now. That said I don't know what they cost for the ones needed for driving. Either way we've gone from thousands or tens of thousands into the hundreds dollar range now.

Looking at prices, I think you are wrong and automotive Lidar is still in the 4 to 5 figure range. HESAI might ship Lidar units that cheap, but automotive grade still seems quite expensive: https://www.cratustech.com/shop/lidar/

Re: The Waymo World Model

#89

Post by mattlondon »

Suddenly all this focus on world models by Deep mind starts to make sense. I've never really thought of Waymo as a robot in the same way as e.g. a Boston Dynamics humanoid, but of course it is a robot of sorts.

Google/Alphabet are so vertically integrated for AI when you think about it. Compare what they're doing - their own power generation , their own silicon, their own data centers, search Gmail YouTube Gemini workspace wallet, billions and billions of Android and Chromebook users, their ads everywhere, their browser everywhere, waymo, probably buy back Boston dynamics soon enough (they're recently partnered together), fusion research, drugs discovery.... and then look at ChatGPT's chatbot or grok's porn. Pales in comparison.

Re: The Waymo World Model

#90

Post by ChadNauseam »

FL33TW00D wrote: post #82
Kapura wrote: post #74

Interesting that this should come out right as lawmakers are beginning to understand that Waymos have overseas operators making major decisions. [*] https://futurism.com/advanced-transport/waymos-controlled-wo...

Completely false: https://x.com/i/status/2019213765506670738 Listen to the statement. The operators help when the Waymo is in a "difficult situation". Car drives itself 99% of the time, long tail of issues not yet fixed have a human intervene. Everyone is making out like it's an RC car, completely false.

Whenever something like this comes out, it's a good moment to find people with no critical thinking skills who can safely be ignored. Driving a waymo like an RC car from the philippines? you can barely talk over zoom with someone in the philippines without bitrate and lag issues.
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