Live data from Hacker News

ICE and Palantir: US agents using health data to hunt illegal immigrants

bmj.com

81–90 of 281 posts

Re: ICE and Palantir: US agents using health data to hunt illegal immigrants

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm reading this correctly, they're just straight up violating the law HHS says “under the Immigration and Nationality Act, ‘any information in any records kept by any department or agency of the government as to the identity and location of aliens in the US shall be made available to’ immigration authorities.” If that’s true, they’re following the law.

Key part of what you wrote: "as to the identity and location of aliens" - so whatever claim they have to access health information applies to aliens. The big question is: are they harvesting citizens' health records illegally as part of this effort, and if so, when do those responsible see jail time?

> are they harvesting citizens' health records illegally as part of this effort, and if so, when do those responsible see jail time?

I’m honestly curious if this would be a Privacy Act or HIPAA violation. The article seems to be unsure on this.

Re: ICE and Palantir: US agents using health data to hunt illegal immigrants

#83

Private surveillance is so much more scary than regular government surveillance because they have every incentive to invent new ways of surveilling you that they then try to sell to governments, or private actors who want to influence the world. It's like classic government surveillance but every company you interacted with and every app you use may at some point turn on you and use your data against you, just becaus…

And then governments use this data, but can wash their hands of it saying "we didn't collect it"

Re: ICE and Palantir: US agents using health data to hunt illegal immigrants

#84
post #77

How are Palantir so effective (as this article is alluding)? From a cynical British perspective, when I think of government departments and civil servants. I think inefficiency, data siloing, politics and lack of communication between departments and also internally not communicating between teams. Not withstanding a lack of cooperating and willingness to change. Did Palantir have a political mandate, or can they jus…

Palantir's mission is to exactly solve the problem you're describing: break through data siloes to get better information. Core of the platform are data pipelines that can move data from any silo into the palantir data lake, where it can be analysed. Their forward engineering project approach probably enables them to bypass the organisational boundaries between departments. Their top-down selling approach ensures man…

> break through data siloes to get better information

This is the pitch of every consulting company ever.

In this case, Palantir is doing VLOOKUP on healthcare records to get suspects’ addresses. They then put that in a standalone app because you can’t charge buttloads of money for a simple query.

Re: ICE and Palantir: US agents using health data to hunt illegal immigrants

#85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm reading this correctly, they're just straight up violating the law HHS says “under the Immigration and Nationality Act, ‘any information in any records kept by any department or agency of the government as to the identity and location of aliens in the US shall be made available to’ immigration authorities.” If that’s true, they’re following the law.

Key part of what you wrote: "as to the identity and location of aliens" - so whatever claim they have to access health information applies to aliens. The big question is: are they harvesting citizens' health records illegally as part of this effort, and if so, when do those responsible see jail time?

[deleted]

Re: ICE and Palantir: US agents using health data to hunt illegal immigrants

#86

If I'm reading this correctly, they're just straight up violating the law. They're sharing information with ICE under an obligation to share information of aliens, but they're actually sharing everyone's information in an effort to identify aliens. That seems like a pretty slam shut case if there were any mechanism to investigate and prosecute it.

I thought undocumented migrants weren’t allowed to use Medicare or Medicaid. How is that data useful to track them down, then?

Re: ICE and Palantir: US agents using health data to hunt illegal immigrants

#87

How are Palantir so effective (as this article is alluding)? From a cynical British perspective, when I think of government departments and civil servants. I think inefficiency, data siloing, politics and lack of communication between departments and also internally not communicating between teams. Not withstanding a lack of cooperating and willingness to change. Did Palantir have a political mandate, or can they jus…

You do know that Palantir is now in the UK and getting access to data through the same "health" channels, don't you ? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-56590249

Re: ICE and Palantir: US agents using health data to hunt illegal immigrants

#89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article says the data was 'surveilled' by Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services and HHS in the performance of Medicare/Medicaid claims, with that surveillance fed to Palentir. Palentir has certainly assisted, but the origin of the data collection here was public and then unleashed by the state to private entity.

> Palentir has certainly assisted, but the origin of the data collection here was public Yes, it's surely public information and therefore ought to be subject to the same controls as any other personal health information. It seems moot that it was given to a private company; the issue just shifts to being that the private company (apparently) does not comply with data protection laws, e.g. HIPAA.

PHI collected by private entities that receive no state or federal funding whatsoever is still PHI and has the same PHI protections as data collected by the government directly. "Public information" doesn't play any role here.

Re: ICE and Palantir: US agents using health data to hunt illegal immigrants

#90

If I'm reading this correctly, they're just straight up violating the law. They're sharing information with ICE under an obligation to share information of aliens, but they're actually sharing everyone's information in an effort to identify aliens. That seems like a pretty slam shut case if there were any mechanism to investigate and prosecute it.

I thought undocumented migrants weren’t allowed to use Medicare or Medicaid. How is that data useful to track them down, then?

HHS is broader than CMMS. Someone who was formerly legal could now be illegal. But more prominently, Miller and Noem have focused on illegally deporting pending asylum cases to juice their numbers. Those folks may show up in HHS (and IRS) data.
Post reply on HN