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A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

joseph-smith.co.uk

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Re: A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

#81

Post by shadowgovt »

ecb_penguin wrote: post #29

I have no idea what the contract says, what was paid, or any of the other conversations they've had. All I see is someone complaining publicly about a private matter. When that happens, I assume they're wrong. Normal people don't air petty grievances on the internet. They use the courts and other mechanisms. According to another comment, the business is dissolved. They don't care if their site goes down. So this guy…

Counterpoint: airing petty grievances on the Internet has proven, time and again, to be a remarkably effective way of getting the grievance addressed by an otherwise inaccessible third party.

Evidence: just about every post on Hacker News about Google breaking that eventually attracts a personal followup from a Googler who reads HN.

If you're angry about not getting paid and your client has given you control over part of their public-facing persona, I can definitely see using that control to make it known that you are in a state of disunion with them. I can even see it being done with no harm to your reputation because other future potential clients know they will be able to pay you.

Re: A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

#82

Post by closewith »

Teever wrote: post #70
KomoD wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could do a credit check. And in this particular case since they're a UK company, yeah, you can just look at their reported accounts. 2023 CURRENT ASSETS: £571 Creditors: Amounts Falling Due Within One Year: £28,051 ---- That's not a client I'd take.

Wait, what, Anyone can check the balance of a UK company's chequing account?

Limited liability companies have to submit their accounts annually. Most small business accounts aren't audited, so it's self-reported at that level, but still useful to check scale, cash crunch, etc.

Re: A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

#83

Post by yieldcrv »

mrtksn wrote: post #39
yieldcrv wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

because social shaming is faster and cheaper than the legal system and doesn’t involve physical violence like the mafia

I guess its something you can do if you don't care about your reputation and you need the money now, this is because It's very uncomfortable to work with people who throw a scene just like that. We haven't heard the other side of the argument, have we? Maybe it's not as simple as services delivered payment withheld.

I’ve taken risks like that, bucking “reputation” scare tactics, and people respected me more

I’ve seen a lot of things like that flip over the last 2 decades

Where the abuser doesn’t tend to be able to control reputation across an industry, so they can be called out

A freelance software developer wouldn't be affected by that, YMMV

Re: A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

#84

Post by josefresco »

EGreg wrote: post #14
josefresco wrote: post #5

I build websites for a living and sometimes people don't pay their bills. Their website going down is usually not a big deal (sometimes they don't notice for months!). But their email, now THAT is a show stopper every time (instant payment).

How do you get their email to go down exactly?

I should clarify this is for clients who host their website, AND email with us (we simply change their pw). There's no way in hell I'm taking down someone's email if they host with a 3rd party even if they are past due. Sure I have that "control" but for me it's crossing the line. We suspend only the services we host and it turns out people respond almost immediately when their email is offline.

Re: A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

#85

Post by EGreg »

zamalek wrote: post #80
EGreg wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I refuse to believe that people can do downvotes on a long-ish comment 4 seconds after something is posted . Not even read. Posted. That means they had to refresh exactly at that moment, within a second of it being posted, scroll down the page to that comment, read it, and downvote it, in 4 seconds! Come on

Corrective votes will follow, if warranted.

I don't think automated downvote brigading is good for HN. It buries items and then by the time they are found and upvoted, it's basically been buried. Anyway...

Re: A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

#86

Post by Forgeties79 »

KomoD wrote: post #63
Forgeties79 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But how? Make them show me their books? Aside from a downpayment idk what else there is

You could do a credit check. And in this particular case since they're a UK company, yeah, you can just look at their reported accounts. 2023 CURRENT ASSETS: £571 Creditors: Amounts Falling Due Within One Year: £28,051 ---- That's not a client I'd take.

I legitimately did not know we could do that in the US. A cursory search says we can I think?

Re: A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

#87

Post by smt88 »

ecb_penguin wrote: post #57
smt88 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is illegal in most places unless the contract says otherwise. You don't have a lien on a website or domain the way you do for a car.

I didn't say anything about the legality... They asked how to block email. Both of these would work. There's no reason to respond to questions or points nobody is making.

You don't think there's a reason to say someone's illegal advice is illegal? OK.

Re: A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

#88

Post by smt88 »

toast0 wrote: post #71
smt88 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is illegal in most places unless the contract says otherwise. You don't have a lien on a website or domain the way you do for a car.

How is disabling the account when it's not being paid for illegal? Beyond some grace period, if I'm not paid, I'm not accepting your mail. If I'm not being paid, I'm not answering DNS queries on your behalf either. I'm not going to interfere with your contract with a different party that handles your mail or DNS if that's how you manage your mail or DNS. I'm a nice guy so I'll signal a temporary error and if you arra…

DNS is generally prepaid. You can't sabotage services because you aren't being paid. For example, a landlord can't disable someone's prepaid internet when he stops receiving their rent.

The remedy for failure to pay is to seek payment or sue, not to sabotage the client's business.

Re: A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

#89

Post by toast0 »

smt88 wrote: post #88
toast0 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is disabling the account when it's not being paid for illegal? Beyond some grace period, if I'm not paid, I'm not accepting your mail. If I'm not being paid, I'm not answering DNS queries on your behalf either. I'm not going to interfere with your contract with a different party that handles your mail or DNS if that's how you manage your mail or DNS. I'm a nice guy so I'll signal a temporary error and if you arra…

DNS is generally prepaid. You can't sabotage services because you aren't being paid. For example, a landlord can't disable someone's prepaid internet when he stops receiving their rent. The remedy for failure to pay is to seek payment or sue, not to sabotage the client's business.

So if you paid me Jan 1 2025 for one year of DNS service and now it's Jan 1 2026 and you didn't pay me again, I'm supposed to keep serving your DNS?

If the money runs out, the service turns off. That's not sabotage anymore than the phone company turning off your phone or the electric company turning off your power. Although phone and electricity may have regulated shutoff procedures.

Re: A web developer posted a payment shaming message on their client's site

#90

Post by reaperducer »

WhitneyLand wrote: post #49
ecb_penguin wrote: post #29

I have no idea what the contract says, what was paid, or any of the other conversations they've had. All I see is someone complaining publicly about a private matter. When that happens, I assume they're wrong. Normal people don't air petty grievances on the internet. They use the courts and other mechanisms. According to another comment, the business is dissolved. They don't care if their site goes down. So this guy…

Yeah, I’d be wary of hiring the developer even if he’s in the right.

Yeah, I’d be wary of hiring the developer even if he’s in the right.

If you pay him, you'll have no problems.

You were planning to pay, weren't you?

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