TIL Ocado is supposed to be an automation/robotics co. I associate it more with delivery vans that seem to be in no particular hurry (unlike uber eats / DPD / UPS etc)
it's just a wheeled bot that's driven by a joystick by some offshore person /s
Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far
81–90 of 342 posts
Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far
#82Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sure, but not the kitchen staff, which is where the robotics dream is supposed to take you.
I watched a show over 20 years ago that showed a fully automated robotic kitchen at McDonalds. I can only assumed they have continued to evolved it and perfect it as the technology has improved. I think it’s simply a question of when it hits the tipping point on cost. There may also be an issue with logistics when it comes to making sure the machines keep running if there is a problem. They can barely keep the ice cr…
I imagine kitchen robots are harder than they might sound. Kitchens are rough environments for machines. They are hot, greasy, and steamy. And everything that comes in contact with food needs to be able to be taken apart, washed, and sanitized at least daily.
Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far
#83Earlier quoted context omitted.
McDonald’s is an interesting example because they’re increasingly replacing cashiers with kiosks. Robotics/LLMs seem to have diminishing returns compared to that in the order taking realm.
I hate those stupid things so much. They're really, as far as I can tell, just moving all labor to the kitchen and drive-thru, while considering the dining area an afterthought. Maybe they're just following the trends their own numbers tell them are happening, but I don't think they trust robotics enough to put an area they truly care about under its purview just yet.
Even 30 years ago more than half the sales at a McDonalds were in the drive through. Some new McDonalds don’t have much of an inside dining room at all anymore, while having multiple drive through lanes.
Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far
#84Whenn I lived in Atlanta the Krogers each had a nickname. There was disco Kroger because of its disco ball. There was murder Kroger that purportedly had been the site of a murder. This I guess is Robo Kroger.
I like to imagine that whenn is like iff -- ie, when would mean "when and only when", lol
Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far
#85Earlier quoted context omitted.
But I think in the cities Kroger grocery stores serve as the fulfilment centers, so they don't need robotic ones. There's probably still room for automation, but it might have to be different than warehouse automation.
It depends on your business model. If a basket of groceries brought online costs $15 more than the in-store prices, then you can pick in-store profitably, very easy. That's the instacart model. But if a basket of groceries brought online costs about the same as buying in-store? With the retailer bearing the costs of picking, packing and delivery instead of the customer? Well then you need something more efficient tha…
And how about charging more in store than online?
On two separate occasions, I stopped by Walmart recently and spent $0.50 extra and $1.50 extra by walking in, going to the aisle, and picking up the item myself.
The Walmart app even tells you that the price on the app is only for online orders. But I didn’t want to wait for an unknown amount of time for a Walmart employee to bring it out to my car (been more than 10 to 15min a few times).
So basically, I pay extra to avoid that volatility in time to run that errand, and I do more work for it.
Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far
#86Earlier quoted context omitted.
Had a large-format (for its time) chain store in Canada like that until 1996: https://www.tvo.org/article/what-happened-to-consumers-distr... Basically a catalogue store without shipping to your door.
Reading the history of Consumers (thanks, I never knew this existed): >In the 1990s, Consumers Distributing struggled to compete with Zellers and then Walmart Canada. Consumers Distributing sought bankruptcy protection in 1996. And Zellers went under just a few years ago...
Sorry to say but 2013 was more than a few years ago...
Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far
#87Having FCs an hour away from your customers, packing groceries into a tiny truck with one or two employees per truck, the trucks alone would never pay for themselves let alone the FCs. This was obvious from the get go and it’s why Walmart has been the only one successfully doing grocery pickup and delivery for 6 years. Every store is an FC and they’re all within 20 minutes of their customers.
There are examples of the warehouse-based model working, but they clearly require both density _and_ mindshare. Its not clear Kroger had either based on the other comments in here. FreshDirect in NYC has been operating since the early 2000s with a fleet of tiny trucks with a couple of employees in them and a giant FC with essentially zero retail footprint.
(As an aside, they also have some of the best meat and produce you can get in the city without going to a farmers market. So many retail grocery stores here lack loading docks, the food handling getting from the truck to the sidewalk to the basement of the store to the shelves is really, really rough especially during the summer months. Skipping that and going warehouse-to-home has advantages)
Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
Had a large-format (for its time) chain store in Canada like that until 1996: https://www.tvo.org/article/what-happened-to-consumers-distr... Basically a catalogue store without shipping to your door.
Reading the history of Consumers (thanks, I never knew this existed): >In the 1990s, Consumers Distributing struggled to compete with Zellers and then Walmart Canada. Consumers Distributing sought bankruptcy protection in 1996. And Zellers went under just a few years ago...
I had hair when Zellers went under
Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far
#89Earlier quoted context omitted.
Probably because you then need pillars throughout the entire building to support the second floor which you are loading down with a ton of weight. The average forklift weighs 3x or more the weight of the average car, and then adding racking and stock on top of that. Yeah if you completely redesign your storage system to not require forklifts you save weight there, but you end up adding the weight back with all the he…
Then put the warehouse on the first floor and put the store on top. Lots of big cities have grocery stores with parking garages under them, doesn’t seem much different.
The difference is the 100x the cost to build it and the completely different amounts of foot traffic and margins available in dense city centers. Nobody is going to build such a store if their return on investment is expected 50-100 years down the road.
Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far
#90Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sounds like the old general store model, you didn’t browse yourself, the shop keep would bring out what you wanted, it was always behind the counter. I experienced this in China when I started visiting in 1999/early 2000s, it’s mostly not like that anymore though. You still have department stores where you need to buy things first before touching them, though.
Had a large-format (for its time) chain store in Canada like that until 1996: https://www.tvo.org/article/what-happened-to-consumers-distr... Basically a catalogue store without shipping to your door.
Argos in the UK was similar. You would go into the store and look up the product in a catalog. Then go to counter and order it, wait 2-5 minutes and they give you the product. I found it quite convenient.