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Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

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Re: Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

#81

Post by SketchySeaBeast »

drcongo wrote: post #51
hannob wrote: post #31

I found the intro very confusing, tbh. Particularly the "no increased risk of all-cause mortality". I mean, if we assume the vaccines worked, we'd certainly expect a decreased risk of all-case mortality (because "all-case mortality" certainly includes "covid mortality"). Reading "no increase" seems to imply "it doesn't change anything". Yeah, technically, the sentence does not say that ("no increase" can mean "no dec…

[flagged]

I honestly wonder if it's better to flag and downvote into oblivion rather than to engage in good faith. The sibling didn't seem like they were trolling, just misguided, and shutting down discussion doesn't allow for any reflection.

I suppose the problem is that it was unlikely to be productive.

Re: Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

#82

Post by jmye »

rkapsoro wrote: post #74
dalbaugh wrote: post #5

Unfortunately, I don't think any additional evidence will convince vaccine skeptics of the safety of mRNA vaccines

This is the wrong attitude to take to the problem. While I grant there were many who were disposed to be irrational skeptics, lots of skepticism was generated by dishonest messaging, coercive mandates, and punitive limitations on dissenting speech. Institutions took an end-justifies-the-means strategy, and many smelled a rat. Even now, online, you see right wing users continuing to lament over vaccine injuries, and o…

> punitive limitations on dissenting speech

Rank bullshit or whining that people aren’t forced to associate with others against their will - not sure which basis for your statement is worse.

Re: Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

#83

Post by ceejayoz »

mathgeek wrote: post #24
clashncruz wrote: post #12

[flagged]

Looking forward to reading your work, please do link it when it's available as there's no point in arguing for or against something that we don't yet have access to.

They claim "Thailand, Vietnam, Cambodia, etc., who had 0 deaths from COVID-19 during the "pandemic", and only had COVID-19 deaths ever recorded AFTER the experimental injections were administered."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_COVID-19_pande... says Thailand's health ministry publicly recorded their first death in March 1, 2020. So it's transparently bullshit.

Re: Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

#84

Post by stetrain »

CWuestefeld wrote: post #78
cogman10 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a false dichotomy. If the results showed that mRNA vaccines had negative health outcomes, then the obvious next question to ask is "are they worse or better than COVID's health outcomes?". If they are better then yeah, I'll still say take the shot. If the negative outcomes only occur in certain demographics, then I'd say they should limit their exposure to the shot. The most common skeptic position that I've s…

The most common skeptic position that I've seen (which admittedly isn't all of them) is that the shots should be banned altogether until they can be proven 100% safe for everyone. That's not what I've seen. I live in very-red Tennessee. What I see is more like what you said yourself: If they are better then yeah, I'll still say take the shot. If the negative outcomes only occur in certain demographics, then I'd say t…

Who is requiring children to get the COVID vaccine?

Re: Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

#85

Post by jmye »

ekianjo wrote: post #71
dalbaugh wrote: post #5

Unfortunately, I don't think any additional evidence will convince vaccine skeptics of the safety of mRNA vaccines

[flagged]

“Why didn’t doctors listen to my completely unsourced opinion in their field?! I can write computer programs, don’t they know that!”

You have absolutely no idea what you saw. Sometimes, it’s ok to not have strong opinions about things you know you’re completely unqualified to understand or diagnose.

Re: Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

#86

Post by groestl »

hannob wrote: post #31

I found the intro very confusing, tbh. Particularly the "no increased risk of all-cause mortality". I mean, if we assume the vaccines worked, we'd certainly expect a decreased risk of all-case mortality (because "all-case mortality" certainly includes "covid mortality"). Reading "no increase" seems to imply "it doesn't change anything". Yeah, technically, the sentence does not say that ("no increase" can mean "no dec…

A common pattern you'd find in reliable research papers is that authors tend to understate their findings, which in practice strengthens the impact of their conclusions.

Re: Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

#87

Post by mathgeek »

ceejayoz wrote: post #83
mathgeek wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looking forward to reading your work, please do link it when it's available as there's no point in arguing for or against something that we don't yet have access to.

They claim "Thailand, Vietnam, Cambodia, etc., who had 0 deaths from COVID-19 during the "pandemic", and only had COVID-19 deaths ever recorded AFTER the experimental injections were administered." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_COVID-19_pande... says Thailand's health ministry publicly recorded their first death in March 1, 2020. So it's transparently bullshit.

Yeah, admittedly while I like to give folks the benefit of the doubt, I assumed this wasn't coming from a place of good will.

Re: Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

#88

Post by andreygrehov »

wnevets wrote: post #67
andreygrehov wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FDA is imposing stricter vaccine protocols due to children deaths linked to Covid-19 vaccine-related myocarditis [1]. [1] https://www.the-independent.com/news/world/americas/us-polit...

RFK Jr's FDA is imposing stricter vaccine protocols due to children deaths linked to Covid-19 vaccine-related myocarditis.

Are they lying about the deaths? I'm not following.

Re: Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

#89

Post by hervature »

ceejayoz wrote: post #44
hannob wrote: post #31

I found the intro very confusing, tbh. Particularly the "no increased risk of all-cause mortality". I mean, if we assume the vaccines worked, we'd certainly expect a decreased risk of all-case mortality (because "all-case mortality" certainly includes "covid mortality"). Reading "no increase" seems to imply "it doesn't change anything". Yeah, technically, the sentence does not say that ("no increase" can mean "no dec…

Eh, it's an important point. "It made COVID things much better, and it didn't make other unrelated things worse."

Looking at Table 2 and as the name suggests, COVID is included in "all-cause" mortality. Your statement does not follow because it could have made COVID outcomes better yet "all-other" causes worse for a neutral "no increase in all-cause". If you look at Table 2, you can see that the vaccinated group is less mortality in all diseases. That being said, as much as I think this is over-stated, this is very much a correlation thing because we all know that unvaccinated individuals live their lives differently compared to vaccinated individuals. Even accounting for similar statistics, the one group is prone to higher death rates not because they are unvaccinated but because of the reason they are unvaccinated.

Re: Covid-19 mRNA Vaccination and 4-Year All-Cause Mortality

#90

Post by cogman10 »

CWuestefeld wrote: post #78
cogman10 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a false dichotomy. If the results showed that mRNA vaccines had negative health outcomes, then the obvious next question to ask is "are they worse or better than COVID's health outcomes?". If they are better then yeah, I'll still say take the shot. If the negative outcomes only occur in certain demographics, then I'd say they should limit their exposure to the shot. The most common skeptic position that I've s…

The most common skeptic position that I've seen (which admittedly isn't all of them) is that the shots should be banned altogether until they can be proven 100% safe for everyone. That's not what I've seen. I live in very-red Tennessee. What I see is more like what you said yourself: If they are better then yeah, I'll still say take the shot. If the negative outcomes only occur in certain demographics, then I'd say t…

> That's not what I've seen.

It's common enough that there are state legislatures trying to ban mRNA vaccines all together. [1]

> since covid risk to young children is negligible, why the heck are you requiring them to get a shot?

Kids spread covid and no vaccine is 100% effective.

I've not seen any evidence that the vaccine is dangerous to any age group. There is plenty of evidence that COVID is deadly to the very young, the very old, and a bunch of other people (including those with compromised immune systems).

It's exactly the same reason kids should get the flu shot.

That said, there's no requirement anywhere for kids to get either.

[1] https://www.krem.com/article/news/local/idaho/proposed-idaho...

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