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Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

freemalaysiatoday.com

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Re: Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

#81

Post by cedws »

colonial wrote: post #76

After spending a summer working in Singapore, I fully support introducing corporal punishment to America (and accelerated capital punishment for drug trafficking offenses.) It turns out that - surprise! - actually punishing criminals where it hurts, even for "petty" offenses, works wonders for making your country a nice place to live. Now, obviously, Singapore's methods aren't perfect - a common complaint I heard was…

The way I think of is is that crime is like a market. When the consequences are low, crime will rise. If you introduce such severe consequences for crimes that criminals never dare do it again, crime will inevitably fall. Singapore seems to get this but none of the rest of us do.

Re: Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

#82

Post by somat »

epolanski wrote: post #55
veqq wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What would you even call their socioeconomic system? China economically functions similarly to Singapore, with long documented connections and explicit emulation. In 1978, Deng Xiaoping already began this and hundreds of thousands of Chinese officials and leaders were trained there and in industrial parks with the explicit goal of knowledge sharing with the dream of "planting 1000 Singapores". [0, 1, 2, 3] > fascis…

On top of that: I'm sick of people writing fascism when they mean dictatorship.

As best I understand it fascism originally described a sort of reverse socialism, I mean realistically it was socialist, it was after the same end goals as socialist policy, but it achieved them in the opposite manner, Where socialism seeks to balance corporate power usually by increased regulation and control of the corporations which has the side effect of incorporating them into the state. fascism seeks to balance state power by having corporations run the state. Which is the same end result, the corporations are incorporated into the state.

But any way you swing it fascism did not stand for that very long and now days usually is intended to mean a police or military state. Or more often because nobody knows what fascism is but everyone knows that it is objectively bad it is what you call your political opponent. case closed, argument won.

Re: Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

#83

Post by anon291 »

digianarchist wrote: post #72
rauljordan2020 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Singaporeans have insanely high quality of life and high pride in their system and people. They have an immense number of negative freedoms that the average person across the world could only dream of: freedom from violence, freedom from the devastating effects of drug addiction on families and society, freedom from poverty, freedom from corruption, freedom from instability. For the average person looking to raise a…

Singaporeans have chosen economic security and social authoritarianism over the freedoms we enjoy in the West. That's their choice. A powerful passport doesn't mean they can move anywhere to live permanently and if they choose to become a citizen of the country they do move to then they will lose their Singaporean citizenship.

Most western European countries are as restrictive on speech as Singapore but are just dishonest.

American freedom of expression is a singular achievement.

Re: Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

#84

Post by esperent »

ETH_start wrote: post #78

One thing I noticed when I was traveling in Singapore is that the businesses don't put their patio chairs away at night because unlike where I'm originally from on the West Coast, they won't get stolen if left out. I think there's thousands of these small benefits that come with a low crime society that are hard to quantify but cumulatively add up.

Does the low crime come from the strict laws, or from being tiny? My money is that most of it is the latter.

Also, I'd say that it's only low crime when it comes to small crimes. If you include financial crime then it's probably the opposite.

Re: Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

#85

Post by naveen99 »

esperent wrote: post #84
ETH_start wrote: post #78

One thing I noticed when I was traveling in Singapore is that the businesses don't put their patio chairs away at night because unlike where I'm originally from on the West Coast, they won't get stolen if left out. I think there's thousands of these small benefits that come with a low crime society that are hard to quantify but cumulatively add up.

Does the low crime come from the strict laws, or from being tiny? My money is that most of it is the latter. Also, I'd say that it's only low crime when it comes to small crimes. If you include financial crime then it's probably the opposite.

Probably ppp gdp per Capita of $155k.

Re: Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

#86

Post by epolanski »

somat wrote: post #82
epolanski wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On top of that: I'm sick of people writing fascism when they mean dictatorship.

As best I understand it fascism originally described a sort of reverse socialism, I mean realistically it was socialist, it was after the same end goals as socialist policy, but it achieved them in the opposite manner, Where socialism seeks to balance corporate power usually by increased regulation and control of the corporations which has the side effect of incorporating them into the state. fascism seeks to balance…

You can't have any authoritarian government labeled as fascist if:

- it lacks the reactionary qualities of fascism: ideological rejections of liberal democracy, rationalism, and it's equal distance from capitalism and socialism.

- it lacks the revolutionary qualities: the centrality of the creation of a new man, the overthrowing of institutions through total mobilization (not just military, but the entire society)

- it lacks the expansionist, colonialist, ethnic-and-cultural focuses of fascisms

Under this light, there is one, and only one other government that chased the same revolutionary and reactionary ideologies, nazi Germany, with a distant second one being imperial Japan.

Spain, Chile, Argentina, Portugal are (very, very) distant thirds.

And even the distant thirds often lack the fascist qualities:

- Pinochet's came from a coup, not from a movement. It had none of the revolutionary or reactionary qualities of fascism.

- Spain's Franco outright rejected overt fascism starting already since ww2 and purged its own party from fascist elements, instead embracing a more classical combination of nationalism-monarchy-religion authoritarian regime.

- Argentina's Peronism allowed both for elections, dissent and lacked any expansionist or totalitarian ambitions.

- Salazar's Portugal outright refused mass-mobilization and the revolutionary dynamism of fascism. It exalted obedience and order, not conquest and transformation.

> But any way you swing it fascism did not stand for that very long

It absolutely did, from start to the end of the regimes in all of Italy, Germany and Japan.

Re: Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

#87

Post by Gud »

colonial wrote: post #76

After spending a summer working in Singapore, I fully support introducing corporal punishment to America (and accelerated capital punishment for drug trafficking offenses.) It turns out that - surprise! - actually punishing criminals where it hurts, even for "petty" offenses, works wonders for making your country a nice place to live. Now, obviously, Singapore's methods aren't perfect - a common complaint I heard was…

A few months is not enough to get a good understanding of the local culture.

I have lived in a lot of places.

Re: Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

#88

Post by colonial »

Gud wrote: post #87
colonial wrote: post #76

After spending a summer working in Singapore, I fully support introducing corporal punishment to America (and accelerated capital punishment for drug trafficking offenses.) It turns out that - surprise! - actually punishing criminals where it hurts, even for "petty" offenses, works wonders for making your country a nice place to live. Now, obviously, Singapore's methods aren't perfect - a common complaint I heard was…

A few months is not enough to get a good understanding of the local culture. I have lived in a lot of places.

You don't need years to look around and see that (unlike much of the US) there are no homeless addicts, fare evaders, or vandals on the transit in Singapore. (Or, for that matter, murderous psychos with dozens of prior arrests.)

Logically, therefore, they have superior crime policy we should learn from - nothing to do with culture.

Re: Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

#89

Post by Gud »

colonial wrote: post #88
Gud wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A few months is not enough to get a good understanding of the local culture. I have lived in a lot of places.

You don't need years to look around and see that (unlike much of the US) there are no homeless addicts, fare evaders, or vandals on the transit in Singapore. (Or, for that matter, murderous psychos with dozens of prior arrests.) Logically, therefore, they have superior crime policy we should learn from - nothing to do with culture.

But you are wrong. It is entirely possible that the population of Singapore would act exactly the same with a lax policy.

I live in Switzerland. There is no public caning for chewing bubble gum here.

Yet it is an extremely nice place to live in.

I have also lived in Dubai where there is sharia law. Also a nice place for most people

Re: Singapore to cane scammers as billions lost in financial crimes

#90

Post by stefantalpalaru »

rauljordan2020 wrote: post #58
digianarchist wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No freedom of press, no freedom of speech, no freedom of assembly, government owns/operates roughly ⅓ of the economy that features many state monopolies, the PAP maintains a gerrymandered control over the electorate, criticizing the government lands you in court for defamation and conveniently bankrupts can't run for parliament. Singapore is many things but not none of what you've written.

Singaporeans have insanely high quality of life and high pride in their system and people. They have an immense number of negative freedoms that the average person across the world could only dream of: freedom from violence, freedom from the devastating effects of drug addiction on families and society, freedom from poverty, freedom from corruption, freedom from instability. For the average person looking to raise a…

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