Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

brennancenter.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 126 posts

Re: Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

#81

Post by tenuousemphasis »

hnuser123456 wrote: post #55
arp242 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't use your driving license under the proposed SAVE act, as it's not proof of citizenship. Only a few states offer "extended" driving licenses, which do, but also need to be requested separately in most (or all?) states that offer them IIRC. For every other state: you will have to use a passport, birth certificate, or a separate state ID card.

I renewed my license 4 years ago and got an enhanced license with no special request.

OK now we just need to find out how well it works for thousands of other people from different states, social classes, and skin colors and then we'll have some real data.

Re: Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

#82

Post by pogue »

hypeatei wrote: post #33

I'm really not sure how we've normalized corrupt behavior at the highest levels of government. Penalizing law firms for supporting things that Trump doesn't like is insane. Doubly so when they enter agreements to provide free legal services for things he does approve of so that they can "get the monkey off their back" so to speak. All I can hope for is that we punish this behavior in the future when grifting and viol…

Decades and decades of the slow but methodical dismantling of the public education system & it's standards. Then, propagandizing the public with right wing news that tells the populace what's happening is perfectly normal and thinking otherwise is unAmerican/unpatriotic are two things that come to mind immediately.

Re: Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

#83

Post by Hikikomori »

celeritascelery wrote: post #65
nerdponx wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The kind of actual voter fraud that ID requirements would prevent is extremely rare. There are better ways to rig elections than hiring thousands of people to physically show up at different polling centers and vote several times under different names. Even disregarding the fact that voter ID laws are (and historically have been) widely abused to disenfranchise specific groups in the USA, what do you actually gain by…

> what do you actually gain by requiring ID? Preventing non-citizens from voting. Some counties in the US have almost half of the population who are non-citizens. It's great that we have so many people wanting to come to the states, but they can't vote until they become citizens. This is not a controversial issue anywhere except in the US.

They can't vote already.

Re: Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

#84

Post by pogue »

assword wrote: post #80
pogue wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can be incredibly difficult and time consuming to get a birth certificate if you have lost yours. If you work full time, you'd have to take off for an unknown time period (typically multiple hours) to stand in line at a court or other facility that provides them. In some cases, people just don't have the option to take that time off and/or lack vehicle access to get there. Then there's a fee to get a copy, lots of…

Oh man the birth certificate thing is ridiculous. I had to get a new Id from scratch recently and it was the most painful process The state I was born in decided to outsource the handling of birth certificates to some shit tier consulting firm. In order to get my birth certificate shipped to me, I would have to wait over six months simply to process my request (ostensibly due to Covid, but this was 2023). It would ha…

Having each section of our government and it's services privatized it's a whole other issue as well. We're watching the same thing that happened after the collapse of the Soviet Union (and all the Warsaw pact states) happen here in the U.S. right now: the organs of the state being shut down & sold to the highest bidder to create a loyal oligarch class.

Slowly but sure, the USPS, the NWS, and public broadcasting is being destroyed so private entities can scoop up the leftovers or take over in their stead.

Re: Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

#85

Post by celeritascelery »

nerdponx wrote: post #72
celeritascelery wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what do you actually gain by requiring ID? Preventing non-citizens from voting. Some counties in the US have almost half of the population who are non-citizens. It's great that we have so many people wanting to come to the states, but they can't vote until they become citizens. This is not a controversial issue anywhere except in the US.

https://www.migrationpolicy.org/content/noncitizen-voting-us... > There is no evidence that unauthorized immigrants, green-card holders, or immigrants on temporary visas are voting in significant numbers, despite some claims that “millions” of noncitizens are voting in U.S. elections. In fact, audits by election officials and numerous studies reflect that voter fraud by noncitizens is extremely rare. > A [Heritage Fo…

It’s great that those organizations say it’s uncommon. But this shouldn’t even be an issue. It doesn’t take many votes to tip a close election. Requiring ID like every other country is the common sense thing to do. And it helps build confidence in the election process without the need for organizations to try and demonstrate that the election was legitimate after the fact.

Re: Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

#86

Post by tastyface »

jimbo808 wrote: post #69
neaden wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it works fine. There have been extensive efforts to find people voting illegally and it turns up a small handful across the entire country, and many of those are things like returning a recently dead persons mail in ballot that voter ID wouldn't even help with. The fact is that all the evidence says an incredibly small number of people vote who are not legally eligible to do so, and only a small proportion of tho…

It doesn't work if a large portion of the country believes that this issue is causing voter fraud. It doesn't have to be really happening, it just has to be possible and perceived to be happening. We can easily fix that.

Here's the way I see it:

1. Right-wing think tanks spend a bunch of time workshopping ways to gain a few extra % points in elections. Turns out that poor voters without ID vote Democrat more often than not.

2. Those think tanks then disseminate FUD to Fox news and similar outlets that there's widespread voter fraud, illegals voting, etc.!!!

3. Some people get spooked and start losing faith in elections.

4. Voter ID laws pass. Swaths of poor people (majority Democrats) lose the ability to vote and aren't able to spend hours getting IDs. Meanwhile, entrenched powers reduce funding and opening times for offices that can assist with this.

5. Single-party rule gets a bit more entrenched in this country.

The way to address lies and propaganda isn't to just give in to those lies. Any voter ID law must come with a precondition that *everyone* who wants an ID can easily get one, preferably by mail and with about 15 minutes of effort. (Plus accommodations for people who are homeless, lack a birth certificate, etc.) Without such a precondition, the true purpose of these efforts is obvious.

Re: Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

#87

Post by radixdiaboli »

assword wrote: post #80
pogue wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can be incredibly difficult and time consuming to get a birth certificate if you have lost yours. If you work full time, you'd have to take off for an unknown time period (typically multiple hours) to stand in line at a court or other facility that provides them. In some cases, people just don't have the option to take that time off and/or lack vehicle access to get there. Then there's a fee to get a copy, lots of…

Oh man the birth certificate thing is ridiculous. I had to get a new Id from scratch recently and it was the most painful process The state I was born in decided to outsource the handling of birth certificates to some shit tier consulting firm. In order to get my birth certificate shipped to me, I would have to wait over six months simply to process my request (ostensibly due to Covid, but this was 2023). It would ha…

Just to corroborate, I ordered my birth certificate from NY this year and there's an 8 month turn around time. And no Covid shutdowns, last I checked.

Re: Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

#88

Post by xboxnolifes »

hnuser123456 wrote: post #55
arp242 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't use your driving license under the proposed SAVE act, as it's not proof of citizenship. Only a few states offer "extended" driving licenses, which do, but also need to be requested separately in most (or all?) states that offer them IIRC. For every other state: you will have to use a passport, birth certificate, or a separate state ID card.

I renewed my license 4 years ago and got an enhanced license with no special request.

Enhanced licenses only exist in 5 states.

Re: Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

#89

Post by wtallis »

celeritascelery wrote: post #65
nerdponx wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The kind of actual voter fraud that ID requirements would prevent is extremely rare. There are better ways to rig elections than hiring thousands of people to physically show up at different polling centers and vote several times under different names. Even disregarding the fact that voter ID laws are (and historically have been) widely abused to disenfranchise specific groups in the USA, what do you actually gain by…

> what do you actually gain by requiring ID? Preventing non-citizens from voting. Some counties in the US have almost half of the population who are non-citizens. It's great that we have so many people wanting to come to the states, but they can't vote until they become citizens. This is not a controversial issue anywhere except in the US.

You're glossing over the distinction between voting without ID, and registering to vote without having your citizenship confirmed.

Re: Brennan Center for Justice Report: The Campaign to Undermine the Next Election

#90

Post by hypeatei »

samdoesnothing wrote: post #68
hypeatei wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did MAGA win in 2024 if Dems had illegals voting for them? I see right wingers regularly push the narrative that they're the underdog fighting against people rigging the election and that evil Dems are stealing it from them... yet they still go out and vote? Please enlighten us with elections where illegals voted and changed the outcome.

[flagged]

You mean the dilemma provided in your comment?

> democrats don't want voter ID so more non-citizens can vote democrat

If that was true, why would they allow themselves to lose another election?

Post reply on HN