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Where are vacation homes located in the US?

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Re: Where are vacation homes located in the US?

#81

Post by stockresearcher »

As with any stats-laden post, I wanted to understand what exactly a “vacation house” was. A footnote in the article references a “census of housing” and I found information on the US Census website. There are 6 main categories for vacant houses (vacation/seasonal is one of them), and at least some of them have subcategories.

It is pretty likely that “vacation house” doesn’t include a lot of housing that most people would think of when they think about vacation houses. If something is listed on AirBnb or VRBO, for example, it is almost certainly not included in these stats.

Re: Where are vacation homes located in the US?

#82

Post by sokoloff »

ashdksnndck wrote: post #73
snowwrestler wrote: post #33

The article cites the availability of air conditioning as a major factor in vacation home trends. Prior to AC, escaping heat was the main purpose to have a vacation home. That’s why so many vacation homes are near old major cities like Philadelphia, New York, Boston, Chicago, etc. In the summer, families with money escaped to the mountains or the beach, where it was much more pleasant during the hot months. I would g…

If you treat days of the year as fungible, the math on owning a ski condo looks bad. But if you want the ability to look at the weather forecast, see that it is about to dump, then drive to the mountain before the storm arrives and set up shop before they close the highways, you are not going to pay a lot more than the standard nightly rate.

I would expect that people with that mindset would be willing to pay quite a bit more than the standard nightly rate to have that experience.

Re: Where are vacation homes located in the US?

#83

Post by ausbah »

ericmay wrote: post #80
MrDarcy wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a win win win for all involved, owner, renter, and Airbnb. I converted stocks into a vacation home on puget sound and rent it out when we aren’t using it. Demand is high enough that we don’t need to rent it out months in advance so we still feel like it’s mostly ours and we’re not just another guest fitting into Airbnb’s schedule. To your point I liked the liquidity of equities but it has been nice to do some…

Well, arguably it’s a win except for local populations in some areas where enough housing is converted to vacation housing that they complain and don’t like it for various reasons. There is a balance to be struck. I’m sympathetic to that complaint a bit but it’s also a bit like NIMBY. Generally I think the cheapness of travel has been an unsung net negative for humanity as a whole.

yeah seriously there isn’t enough housing in major cities so the little new construction that isn’t rentals has a good chance of turning into an “investment property” via someone buying the mortgage and immediately turning it into a rental unit or airbnb unit. I really think that cities should either outlaw these type of units or tax them heavily and divert all new funds into new housing construction, or just incentivize so much new housing it turns into a losing investment

source: i live in seattle and my partner owns property where 1/4 of their neighbors are landlords in a new construction complex

Re: Where are vacation homes located in the US?

#84

Post by kccqzy »

stockresearcher wrote: post #81

As with any stats-laden post, I wanted to understand what exactly a “vacation house” was. A footnote in the article references a “census of housing” and I found information on the US Census website. There are 6 main categories for vacant houses (vacation/seasonal is one of them), and at least some of them have subcategories. It is pretty likely that “vacation house” doesn’t include a lot of housing that most people w…

If the home listed on Airbnb is also occasionally used by the owner, it would count as a vacation home. Otherwise it's just business property, more similar to a hotel than a vacation home. I got the sense that it's more about vacationing use by the owner, not short-term rental use by a non-owner.

Re: Where are vacation homes located in the US?

#85

Post by mikestew »

xhkkffbf wrote: post #63
jaxn wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, no income tax right when you have less income?

But when you have less money, every dollar counts. The income tax in places like Cali or NYS can be huge because it eats into the disposable income. It could easy cut your disposable income in half or maybe eat it all.

It has been my observation that no-income-tax states make up for it in sales tax and/or property tax. Government is getting its cut one way or another. Of course, retirees will want to skip CA altogether with their income tax and ridiculous sales tax.

Re: Where are vacation homes located in the US?

#86

Post by mancerayder »

snowwrestler wrote: post #33

The article cites the availability of air conditioning as a major factor in vacation home trends. Prior to AC, escaping heat was the main purpose to have a vacation home. That’s why so many vacation homes are near old major cities like Philadelphia, New York, Boston, Chicago, etc. In the summer, families with money escaped to the mountains or the beach, where it was much more pleasant during the hot months. I would g…

High property taxes and insurance costs are another factor that's changed the equation. I'm not sure how profitable it is to operate a second home as a business anymore, unless it's very special and very well marketed. If anything it feels like a personal luxury.

Re: Where are vacation homes located in the US?

#87

Post by mancerayder »

ausbah wrote: post #83
ericmay wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, arguably it’s a win except for local populations in some areas where enough housing is converted to vacation housing that they complain and don’t like it for various reasons. There is a balance to be struck. I’m sympathetic to that complaint a bit but it’s also a bit like NIMBY. Generally I think the cheapness of travel has been an unsung net negative for humanity as a whole.

yeah seriously there isn’t enough housing in major cities so the little new construction that isn’t rentals has a good chance of turning into an “investment property” via someone buying the mortgage and immediately turning it into a rental unit or airbnb unit. I really think that cities should either outlaw these type of units or tax them heavily and divert all new funds into new housing construction, or just incenti…

NYC has outlawed them more than 30 days (unless it's just a room and you're in the unit). NY state has legally created a registry and now smaller towns are requiring permits.

But Seattle and NYC Airbnbs aren't second homes, it's investments people were trying to play with. A vacation home is more a seasonal spot near a beach or a lake or mountain. That sort of stuff doesn't steal some middle class family's chances of renting something cheaper by pulling a unit off the rental market.

Re: Where are vacation homes located in the US?

#88

Post by mancerayder »

yieldcrv wrote: post #42
MrDarcy wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a win win win for all involved, owner, renter, and Airbnb. I converted stocks into a vacation home on puget sound and rent it out when we aren’t using it. Demand is high enough that we don’t need to rent it out months in advance so we still feel like it’s mostly ours and we’re not just another guest fitting into Airbnb’s schedule. To your point I liked the liquidity of equities but it has been nice to do some…

Liquidity is a major factor for me thats kept me out of real estate in the past, have the money burning AI buyers helped make home trading more liquid?

Supply and demand makes investments liquid. If there's no demand you're stuck trying to sell. If there's no supply you'll overpay. Why AI?

Re: Where are vacation homes located in the US?

#89

Post by mancerayder »

vintermann wrote: post #28
terminalshort wrote: post #27

I suspect the "vacation" homes on Manhattan are really mostly empty luxury units for foreign rich people to park money in the US. "Billionaires Row" near Central Park is half empty for just this reason.

Shower thought, maybe bitcoin is actually good for the environment, if it replaces even more wasteful ways of trying to park wealth.

Bitcoin goes up and down in wild, multi month and year swings. Manhattan real estate (condos at least) go only one direction.

Re: Where are vacation homes located in the US?

#90

Post by ericmay »

mancerayder wrote: post #87
ausbah wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yeah seriously there isn’t enough housing in major cities so the little new construction that isn’t rentals has a good chance of turning into an “investment property” via someone buying the mortgage and immediately turning it into a rental unit or airbnb unit. I really think that cities should either outlaw these type of units or tax them heavily and divert all new funds into new housing construction, or just incenti…

NYC has outlawed them more than 30 days (unless it's just a room and you're in the unit). NY state has legally created a registry and now smaller towns are requiring permits. But Seattle and NYC Airbnbs aren't second homes, it's investments people were trying to play with. A vacation home is more a seasonal spot near a beach or a lake or mountain. That sort of stuff doesn't steal some middle class family's chances of…

Pied-à-terre is a thing in places like NYC, London, etc. Certainly you are right that there are differences and different cities have different features which attract different folks with different ideas.

But I think vacation home can include not just a season spot near a beach or lake or mountain - people buy vacation homes in Mallorca, or Venice, or Provence, or wherever too.

I am not really opposed to them or anything like that, I just wanted to point out there are some harmful effects for some places. The travel industry and the ease of travel is probably more of a concern, because instead of having a family buy a vacation property on a beach somewhere, you've got an entire industry turning that vacation spot into a zoo and for the number of people that do live in that vacation area it hollows it out a bit of any sort of meaning. The whole thing becomes a simulation of a vacation spot.

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