Should have listened to those NordVPN ads on YouTube
Anthropic cut up millions of used books, and downloaded 7M pirated ones – judge
81–90 of 686 posts
Re: Anthropic cut up millions of used books, and downloaded 7M pirated ones – judge
#82Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's the law. Please keep in mind, copyright is intended as a compromise between benefit to society and to the individual. A thought experiment, students pirating textbooks and applying that knowledge later on in their work?
When you say that's the law, as far as I'm aware a single ruling by a lower court has been issued which upholds that application. Hardly settled case law.
True, until then best to act as if it is the case.
In my opinion, it will be upheld.
Looking at what is stored and the manner which it is stored. It makes sense that it's fair use.
Re: Anthropic cut up millions of used books, and downloaded 7M pirated ones – judge
#83Earlier quoted context omitted.
There is no copyright on knowledge. If it outputs parts of the book verbatim then that's a different story.
Let's don't change the focus of the debate. Pirating 7 million books, remixing their content, and using that to power Claude.ai is like counterfeiting 7 million branded products and selling them on your personal website. The original creators don't get credit or payment, and someone’s profiting off their work. All this happens while authors, many of them teachers, are left scratching their heads with four kids to fee…
That may be the case, but you'd have to have laws changed.
Re: Anthropic cut up millions of used books, and downloaded 7M pirated ones – judge
#84Pirate and pay the fine is probably hell of a lot cheaper than individually buying all these books. I'm not saying this is justified, but what would you have done in their situation? Sayi "they have the money" is not an argument. It's about the amount of effort that is needed to individually buy, scan, process millions of pages. If that's done for you, why re-do it all?
This is not about paying for a single copy. It would still be wrong even if they have bought every single one of those books.
It is a form of plagiarism. The model will use someone else's idea without proper attribution.
Re: Anthropic cut up millions of used books, and downloaded 7M pirated ones – judge
#85Earlier quoted context omitted.
The judge appears to disagree with you on this. They found that training and selling an LLM are fair use, based on the fact that it is exceedingly transformative, and that the copyright holders are not entitled to any profits thereof due to copyright. (They also did get paid — Anthropic acquired millions of books legally, including all of the authors in this complaint. This would not retroactively absolve them of leg…
The trial is scheduled for December 2025. That's when a jury will decide how much Anthropic owes for copying and storing over seven million pirated books
Yes, that would by an interesting trial. But it is only about six books, and all claims regarding Claude have been dismissed already. So only the internal copies remain, and there the theory for them being infringing is somewhat convoluted: you have to argue that they are not just for purposes of training (which was ruled fair use), and award damages even though these other purposes never materialised (since by now, they have legal copies of those books). I can see it, but I would not count on there being a trial.
Re: Anthropic cut up millions of used books, and downloaded 7M pirated ones – judge
#86Apparently it's a common business practice. Spotify (even though I can't find any proof) seems to have build their software and business on pirated music. There is some more in this Article [0]. https://torrentfreak.com/spotifys-beta-used-pirate-mp3-files... Funky quote: > Rumors that early versions of Spotify used ‘pirate’ MP3s have been floating around the Internet for years. People who had access to the service in…
Crunchyroll was originally an anime piracy site that went legit and started actually licensing content later. They started in mid-2006, got VC funding in 2008, then made their first licensing deal in 2009.
https://www.forbes.com/2009/08/04/online-anime-video-technol...
https://venturebeat.com/business/crunchyroll-for-pirated-ani...
Re: Anthropic cut up millions of used books, and downloaded 7M pirated ones – judge
#87Earlier quoted context omitted.
The problem with this thinking is that hundreds of thousands of teachers who spent years writing great, useful books and sharing knowledge and wisdom probably won't sue a billion dollar company for stealing their work. What they'll likely do is stop writing altogether. I'm against Anthropic stealing teacher's work and discouraging them from ever writing again. Some teachers are already saying this (though probably no…
If you care so little about writing that AI puts you off it, TBH you're probably not a great writer anyhow. Writers that have an authentic human voice and help people think about things in a new way will be fine for a while yet.
Yeah, people will still want to write. They might need new ways to monetize it... that being said, even if people still want to write they may not consider it a viable path. Again, have to consider other monetization.
Re: Anthropic cut up millions of used books, and downloaded 7M pirated ones – judge
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
What are your feelings about how the small fish is stripped of their arts, and their years of work becomes just a prompt? Mainly comic artists and small musicians who are doing things they like and putting out for people, but not for much money?
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I think I have worded my question wrong. I asked about not about how AI affects the financials of these smaller artists, but their wellbeing in general.
There are many small artists who do this not for money, but for fun and have their renowned styles. Even their styles are ripped off by these generative AI companies and turned into a slot machine to earn money for themselves. These artists didn't consent to that, and this affects their (mental) well-beings.
With that context in mind, what do you think about these people who are not in this for money is ripped out of their years of achievement and their hard work exploited for money by generative AI companies?
It's not about IP (with whatever expansion you prefer) or laws, but ethics in general.
Substitute comics for any medium. Code, music, painting, illustration, literature, short movies, etc.
Re: Anthropic cut up millions of used books, and downloaded 7M pirated ones – judge
#89Re: Anthropic cut up millions of used books, and downloaded 7M pirated ones – judge
#90So using the standard industry metrics for calculating the financial impact of piracy, this would equate to something like trillions of damages to the book publishing industry?