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Working on databases from prison

turso.tech

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Re: Working on databases from prison

#81

Post by eru »

nilamo wrote: post #66
catigula wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with this sentiment but I'm also willing to explore/consider the possibility that "innocent until proven guilty" isn't strictly only useful as an esoteric legal construct, but a philosophy that could potentially have applicability to an individual's worldview. That being said I wouldn't have much patience for a "merely" accused murderer or child predator in my personal life, just as I also don't have much pat…

I agree that it is nice to keep in mind as a general philosophy, however I also think it's important to keep in mind that the people who originally wrote "innocent until proven guilty" were all treasonous sepratists, and their philosophy may or may not always align with my own.

Yes, violent insurrection against the lawful authority of the Crown is no laughing matter. (And many of them were slaveowners, so they did not have moral authority neither by the standards of their day nor by ours.)

Re: Working on databases from prison

#83

Post by abxyz »

tonyhart7 wrote: post #65
abxyz wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it is. The courts are flawed, the courts get things wrong all the time. Many innocent people are found guilty. If we must apply the legal standard to internet comments, must we condemn people we believe to be innocent? The legal standards exist for the system, not for people. Saying that the standard of "innocent until proven guilty" should apply outside of the legal system is lazy and avoiding making decisions…

"People proven guilty are not necessarily guilty. People proven not guilty are not necessarily innocent. The legal standard exists because a system needs standards." so you saying that court is useless because its not perfet???? its easy to complaint about something but give NOTHING to improve it You would not do better than people in charge because EASY to say something is wrong but you dont have ANSWER that improve…

I'm saying that the judgement of a court is useless when making a personal judgement because what a court sets out to do is different to what a human sets out to do. The court system is a collection of complicated and convoluted standards and rules and regulations designed specifically to support a system responsible for depriving people of their rights. A court judgement is not "better" than a human judgement, quite the opposite, a court judgement is often worse, because court judgements are formed without access to all information. A jury for example will often have very important information withheld from them because it doesn't satisfy some esoteric court standard. A person would use that information to form a judgement.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#84

Post by busterarm »

bjorkandkd wrote: post #17

[flagged]

That's not what your report says. Your report says there's evidence she may have been beaten and that her arm may have been broken. There's a likelihood of both and that he did it but there's no evidence in that report that he did it.

There is no actual confirmation in that document that her arm was broken, just that that was what was reported to the officer and that it was injured/swolen.

You're free to say "allegedly", just like the standards the media has to go by.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#85

Post by voidUpdate »

komali2 wrote: post #59
voidUpdate wrote: post #3

I'm glad to hear accounts of people in the prison system who are given the opportunity to do some good. While I am admittedly less sympathetic of dealers, the fact that the author recognises that they were in a bad situation and have been able to make positive progress since being given the opportunity to is really nice to hear

I don't know the circumstances of this case, but in many states, e.g. Texas my home state, simply having above an arbitrarily defined amount of a given controlled substance automatically gets you tagged with "intent to sell." An overloaded court system combined with a pay-to-win "justice" system means a lot of people take the charge in their plea deal even if they aren't dealers.

In the part 1 article, the author mentions "making tens of thousands of dollars a week" in relation to drugs, which is why I talked about dealing. Obviously I've got no proof of that or anything, so I'm happy to be proven wrong.

Drug charges are difficult. In my opinion, if you are using drugs personally, I don't really see a problem. If you commit some crime while under the influence which could harm another person, eg driving while drugged, obviously that's a different story, and coercing other people into it isn't great either, but if you're just smoking in your own home, its your body that you're altering. If you're selling to other people, that feels a bit more iffy to me because you're affecting other people with that... though I do realise that preventing the sale is effectively the same as preventing the usage...

Re: Working on databases from prison

#86

Post by kelstar18 »

abxyz wrote: post #69
kelstar18 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Showing compassion to one person doesn’t deserve criticism for not saving everyone.

I'm responding to the claim that it's uncommon for someone in prison to have a good heart.

Purporting that to be a "claim" would be - in my opinion - an incredibly disingenuous reading of the poster's comment. Remember the HN commenting guidelines: "Assume good faith."

Re: Working on databases from prison

#87

Post by mlissner »

Maine's remote work program is an incredibly promising development to prevent recidivism. The amazing thing about it is that it gives real jobs to prisoners that they can seamlessly continue after they get out of prison. Normally when you get out, it's impossible to get a job, and the clock is ticking. This leads to desperation, which leads to bad behavior.

There is a real risk of exploitation, but if it's properly managed, remote work for prisoners is one of the most hopeful things I've heard about the prison system. It gives people purpose while there and an avenue to success once they're out.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#88

Post by qualeed »

eru wrote: post #71
qualeed wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Innocent until proven guilty doesn't extend to internet comments. That's not a good thing. Edit: I cannot really believe that this, of all comments, is controversial. Living life treating everyone as guilty until they prove themselves innocent is... just shitty, let alone exhausting. Do people forget about how many times reddit and other ruined innocent people's lives? Sometimes HN amazes me with new technology, in…

Why? Different fora have different standards of proof. For example, in civil cases (even in America) the standard of proof is 'preponderance of evidence', not 'innocent until proven guilty'. Why should internet comments follow criminal law, and not eg civil law, or some other standard?

The options are you assume people are innocent unless proven guilty, or guilty unless proven innocent.

Going through life treating everyone as guilty until proven innocent sounds like an exhausting and negative way to treat everyone, and harms more people overall.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#89

Post by abxyz »

kelstar18 wrote: post #86
abxyz wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm responding to the claim that it's uncommon for someone in prison to have a good heart.

Purporting that to be a "claim" would be - in my opinion - an incredibly disingenuous reading of the poster's comment. Remember the HN commenting guidelines: "Assume good faith."

That is the good faith reading. The comment isn't open to interpretation. What could the meaning be if not that Preston is an uncommon example of a prisoner?

Re: Working on databases from prison

#90

Post by BryantD »

komali2 wrote: post #59
voidUpdate wrote: post #3

I'm glad to hear accounts of people in the prison system who are given the opportunity to do some good. While I am admittedly less sympathetic of dealers, the fact that the author recognises that they were in a bad situation and have been able to make positive progress since being given the opportunity to is really nice to hear

I don't know the circumstances of this case, but in many states, e.g. Texas my home state, simply having above an arbitrarily defined amount of a given controlled substance automatically gets you tagged with "intent to sell." An overloaded court system combined with a pay-to-win "justice" system means a lot of people take the charge in their plea deal even if they aren't dealers.

Without judging this guy's current state, he makes it clear in his first blog post that he was a dealer.

"So instead of coming back home broke and apologetic, I ended up pretty deep into this and soon was making tens of thousands of dollars a week, very much unapologetically."

Then, after his first sentence:

"I was left with the difficult choice of either living there and walking to a temp agency with hopes of making $10.50/hour doing manual labor (without an ID or social security card at this point), or getting on a bus to NYC to see some associates, and coming back in a week or so with $15-25k in my pocket and living in comfy luxury hotels until I could rent an apartment... I chose the latter: and obviously, was back in prison after a short 14 months of addiction and misery."

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