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Next.js 15.1 is unusable outside of Vercel

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Re: Next.js 15.1 is unusable outside of Vercel

#81

Post by ryandvm »

aitchnyu wrote: post #48
jowday wrote: post #28

Don’t ever use Next. Terrible developer experience, vendor lock in, weird undocumented conventions that make building anything other than some kind of B2B SaaS CRUD site full of undocumented foot guns. My favorite thing I’ve encountered is the Next tag somehow dropping the FPS on a webgl scene on the same page to 2 FPS.

How was Vercel able to frog-boil normal React users with vendor lock-in? React was supposed to be Meta's baby and open source was supposed to defeat vendor lock-in.

I never understood why Facebook was so invested in React. Why can't a 2 trillion dollar company afford to build mobile apps for two platforms?

Re: Next.js 15.1 is unusable outside of Vercel

#82

Post by harrisi »

I've been saying for years that everyone should put much more consideration into using anything that Vercel has its hands in, such as React, Next, and Svelte. Their goal is to lock people in the same way Heroku did, but even more aggressively by tying people to their full stack solutions from the language to the runtime to the machines.

Not that they're the only company to be weary of. I recently found out that Cloudflare's CLI tool for development and deployment only supports macOS 13.5+, which is less than two years old. I couldn't track down why exactly, but it's a sad state of affairs when two years is considered obsolete.

In fairness, you can still use an older version of wrangler, but it's a previous major version. Documentation and features are misaligned, and will only get worse. They could also break compatibility with it on their end in the future.

Meanwhile, new versions of other tools like vim, neovim, emacs, llvm, etc. all still work fine on OS X. I'd argue it's because they have no incentive to lock people in.

Re: Next.js 15.1 is unusable outside of Vercel

#84

Post by koakuma-chan »

tshaddox wrote: post #83
koakuma-chan wrote: post #15

Everybody should be talking about how it takes Next.js 10 seconds to compile a route in development mode. Rust compiler is smoking in the corner.

And bizarrely, next dev —-turbo isn’t any faster on my code base at work.

I confirm. --turbo doesn't do anything.

Re: Next.js 15.1 is unusable outside of Vercel

#85

Post by randomuxx »

I’ve worked with Next.js professionally for the past 3 years, and it’s been torture. (hosted on Vercel, and the company used almost every single service Vercel sold. Worst vendor locked-in ever)

I replied to Dan’s previous HN post about RSC, sharing how I had a terrible experience and he was right to highlight: "I think RSC itself is pretty solid by this point but frameworks around it (primarily Next.js) are still somewhat rough."

React is fairly mid overall, and Next.js is only accelerating its bad reputation. Stay away!

Re: Next.js 15.1 is unusable outside of Vercel

#86

Post by Panchitous »

It’s opinionated, and they’ve been pushing streaming—just like the React team—right? Yes. Is it unusable outside of Vercel? No.

As far as I know, Next works without hiccups if you deploy to containers. However, that’s not our case, as we use Lambdas on AWS. We’ve been using OpenNext since the early versions. I must add that I’ve followed a lot of libraries on Discord, and among all those I’ve joined (PayloadCMS coming second), there’s none as helpful, friendly, and open to discussing issues as OpenNext.

We serve millions of pages per day at TelevisaUnivision, and we have nearly 5 million pages indexed on Google. Since migrating to RSC nearly three years ago (we started with the betas), we now pay only 10% of what we previously did on AWS, and we’ve transformed almost all of our poor-performing pages into fast ones in Google Search Console. We cache significantly more now and don’t follow the typical caching conventions of Next/OpenNext—we use ElastiCache with Redis. Nonetheless, the framework and library have enabled us to do this and even allowed us to use a different CDN (currently Fastly, previously Akamai).

We trigger our deployments from GitHub Actions using SST. It’s opinionated, and one of the individuals behind it isn’t the friendliest, but it works—so I respect it for that.

Re: Next.js 15.1 is unusable outside of Vercel

#87

Post by 6ak74rfy »

What's the recommend full-stack setup, if not NextJS?

My background: I have ~15 years of software development experience, but practically all of it in backend stuff. (Well, I did some AngularJS a decade ago but that's it.) So, when I recently wanted to build a fullstack app for the first time for a side project, I looked around and learnt NextJS was the way to go. (Gemini said that, then Cline's official documentation said the same.) I am early in the process, so happy to learn of solid alternatives.

I am planning to host everything on some VPSes through Docker, because that's what I am comfortable with. So, no Vercel or Netlify.

Re: Next.js 15.1 is unusable outside of Vercel

#88

Post by icemelt8 »

darajava wrote: post #72
pas wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

because they pushed shiny new features that are reaaaallly good for a certain set of commercial users (think webshops, where time to first contentful paint equals time to money) and the tech is not bad, it's just meh (immature and a bit misguided) after all by flipping the whole thing upside down, defaulting to server-side, a lot of previously hard problems became easy (the usual glueing of different APIs - user, CMS…

Can you suggest alternatives? I've used Next and Svelte[kit] in prod and have been very unhappy with both.

No framework, create a SPA using vite

Re: Next.js 15.1 is unusable outside of Vercel

#89

Post by ggregoire »

6ak74rfy wrote: post #87

What's the recommend full-stack setup, if not NextJS? My background: I have ~15 years of software development experience, but practically all of it in backend stuff. (Well, I did some AngularJS a decade ago but that's it.) So, when I recently wanted to build a fullstack app for the first time for a side project, I looked around and learnt NextJS was the way to go. (Gemini said that, then Cline's official documentatio…

If you don't need server rendering, I'd just recommend React without framework, and Vite [1] to run the app in dev and build the app in prod, then host the build (basically a HTML page with a JS file) on AWS S3 or similar static hosting platforms. That's the solution I've been using for 10+ years without any problem.

For the backend you can use whatever you are comfortable with. I mostly use PostgREST [2] nowadays. I recommend to use react-query [3] to call your APIs on the client side.

[1] https://vite.dev

[2] https://docs.postgrest.org

[3] https://tanstack.com/query/latest/docs/framework/react/overv...

Re: Next.js 15.1 is unusable outside of Vercel

#90

Post by ggregoire »

EspadaV9 wrote: post #19
Aeolun wrote: post #16

Next has become a joke. It’s mildly frustrating that with Remix’s inexplicable transformation into react-router, there’s few great react frameworks left (for me), I’m back to plain vite with tanstack router.

I've been trying and learning TanStack Router with a new project and it's been really nice, so nice that I then added TanStack Query, and then also added TanStack Form.

TanStack Query is the best library in the entire frontend ecosystem IMO.

I'm still using React Router tho (as a dumb SPA router, not the new "framework" features). I might take a look at TanStack Router one day.

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