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Tell HN: Help restore the tax deduction for software dev in the US (Section 174)

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Re: Tell HN: Help restore the tax deduction for software dev in the US (Section 174)

#81

Other than it’s nice not to have your profession taxed, what is the argument that software development shouldn’t be taxed as opposed to all sorts of other white collar work?

This isn't changing if it is taxed or not. It is merely about if the tax should be paid in the year the work was done, or spread over the 5 years after the work was done.

Try explaining that to a startup with less than 5 years of runway left.

Re: Tell HN: Help restore the tax deduction for software dev in the US (Section 174)

#82

Signed. That said, here's my perspective on 174 (which should be reverted to full deduction on the year the expense is incurred). You do not have to amortize 100% of your engineering costs. Not even close. Here's the key: Development costs incurred to remove uncertainty are amortized. All other costs are deductible during the tax year where they are incurred. How does this work? You are going to design a new robot ar…

If it's software, you do need to amortize 100%. Section 174 (as amended by the TCJA) has specific language to this effect [1]:

> For purposes of this section, any amount paid or incurred in connection with the development of any software shall be treated as a research or experimental expenditure.

i.e. it needs to be amortized. That's the part that people find most objectionable -- software development is special-cased for unfavorable tax treatment that does not apply to other fields.

[1] https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim...

Re: Tell HN: Help restore the tax deduction for software dev in the US (Section 174)

#83

For folks that don't know the background on this, here's a layperson summary: - A business is usually taxed on its profits: you deduct your revenue from the cost of producing that revenue, and the delta is what you are taxed on. - In software businesses, this usually means if you spend $1M in software development to develop a web app, and it makes $1.1M in that year, you'd get taxed on the $100K profits. - However, a…

Why do you assume a 50% tax rate in the United States when it is only 21%?

I think they meant "assume" like a mathematician, i.e., pretend it is this simple value to make all the calculations easier to understand.

But it's still useful to know the real rate is 21%, thanks.

Re: Tell HN: Help restore the tax deduction for software dev in the US (Section 174)

#85

For folks that don't know the background on this, here's a layperson summary: - A business is usually taxed on its profits: you deduct your revenue from the cost of producing that revenue, and the delta is what you are taxed on. - In software businesses, this usually means if you spend $1M in software development to develop a web app, and it makes $1.1M in that year, you'd get taxed on the $100K profits. - However, a…

Why do you assume a 50% tax rate in the United States when it is only 21%?

State, city, property, social security tax, other fees and levies that should really be classified as taxes. The total tax burden can really add up.

Re: Tell HN: Help restore the tax deduction for software dev in the US (Section 174)

#86
post #47

This is less on that specific topic and more general: While I enjoy the hacker news forums a great deal, I've no relationship with YC as an org. I am not sure that YC has any particular interest in things that might impact me as an individual contributor in an org as much as it impacts them. Understandably there's an everyone for themselves aspect here, but that makes these kinds of call to actions a bit hollow to me…

This is something that both impacts them and impacts you if you're a developer.

This tax treatment can increase the cost of a dev by 5-15% which leads to less hiring and a looser job market. Which will impact us even if we're not looking for work because most companies look at market rates when deciding raises.

Re: Tell HN: Help restore the tax deduction for software dev in the US (Section 174)

#87

For folks that don't know the background on this, here's a layperson summary: - A business is usually taxed on its profits: you deduct your revenue from the cost of producing that revenue, and the delta is what you are taxed on. - In software businesses, this usually means if you spend $1M in software development to develop a web app, and it makes $1.1M in that year, you'd get taxed on the $100K profits. - However, a…

> a few years ago, the IRS stopped allowing the $1M to be deducted

It was Trump's 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act, which amended IRS code.

Re: Tell HN: Help restore the tax deduction for software dev in the US (Section 174)

#89

Signed. That said, here's my perspective on 174 (which should be reverted to full deduction on the year the expense is incurred). You do not have to amortize 100% of your engineering costs. Not even close. Here's the key: Development costs incurred to remove uncertainty are amortized. All other costs are deductible during the tax year where they are incurred. How does this work? You are going to design a new robot ar…

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