Live data from Hacker News

Watching AI drive Microsoft employees insane

old.reddit.com

81–90 of 580 posts

Re: Watching AI drive Microsoft employees insane

#81
post #36
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which almost feels unique to AI. I can't think of another feature so blatently pushed in your face, other then perhaps when everyone lost their minds and decided to cram mobile interfaces onto every other platform.

> I can't think of another feature so blatently pushed in your face Passkeys. As someone who doesn't see the value of it, every hype-driven company seems to be pushing me to replace OPT 2FA with something worse right now.

[deleted]

Re: Watching AI drive Microsoft employees insane

#82
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like that is taking a very long time, on top of some very grandiose promises being delivered today.

I look back over the past 2-3 years and am pretty amazed with how quick change and progress have been made. The promises are indeed large but the speed of progress has been fast. Not defending the promise but “taking a very long time” does not seem to be an accurate representation.

I guess it probably depends on what you are doing. Outside of layers on top of these things (tooling), I personally haven't seen much progress.

Re: Watching AI drive Microsoft employees insane

#83
post #54
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Depends on team but seems management is pushing it The graphic "Internal structure of tech companies" comes to mind, given if true, would explain why the process/workflow is so different between the teams at Microsoft: https://i.imgur.com/WQiuIIB.png Imagine the Copilot team has a KPI about usage, matching the company OKRs or whatever about making sure the world is using Microsoft's AI enough, so they have a mandat…

Well, what you describe is not terrible way to run things. Eat your own dogfood. To get better at it you need to start doing it.

Sure, but if the product in question is at best tangential to your core products, it sucks, and makes your work flow slow to a crawl, I don’t blame employees for not wanting to use it.

For example, if tomorrow my company announced that everyone was being switched to Windows, I would simply quit. I don’t care that WSL exists, overall it would be detrimental to my workday, and I have other options.

Re: Watching AI drive Microsoft employees insane

#84
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the future envisioned by Microsoft. Vibe coding all the way down, social network style. They are putting this in front of the developers as take it or leave it deal. I left the platform, doing my coding old way, hosting it somewhere else. Discoverability? I don't care. I'm coding it for myself and hosting in the open. If somebody finds it, nice. Otherwise, mneh.

> I left the platform, doing my coding old way, hosting it somewhere else. may you please let me know where are you hosting the code ? would love to migrate as well. thank you !

You're welcome. I have moved to Source Hut three years ago [0]. My page is https://sr.ht/~bayindirh/

You can also self-host a Forgejo instance on a €3/mo Hetzner instance (or a free Oracle Cloud server) if you want. I prefer Hetzner for their service quality and server performance.

[0]: https://blog.bayindirh.io/blog/moving-to-source-hut/

Re: Watching AI drive Microsoft employees insane

#86
GitHub has spent billions of dollars building an AI that struggles with things like whitespace related linting errors on one of the most mature repositories available. This would be probably okay for a hobbyist experiment, but they are selling this as a groundbreaking product that costs real money.

Re: Watching AI drive Microsoft employees insane

#87
Many here don't seem to get it.

The AI agent/programmer corpo push is not about the capabilities and whether they match human or not. It's about being able to externalize a majority of one's workforce without having a lot of people on permanent payroll.

Think in terms of an infinitely scalable bunch of consultants you can hire and dismiss at your will - they never argue against your "vision", either.

Re: Watching AI drive Microsoft employees insane

#88
post #10

With how stochastic the process is it makes it basically unusable for any large scale task. What's the plan? To roll the dice until the answer pops up? That would be maybe viable if there was a way to automatically evaluate it 100% but with a human in the loop required it becomes untenable.

> What's the plan? Call me old school, but I find the workflow of "divide and conquer" to be as helpful when working with LLMs, as without them. Although what is needed to be considered a "large scale task" varies by LLMs and implementation. Some models/implementations (seemingly Copilot) struggles with even the smallest change, while others breeze through them. Lots of trial and error is needed to find that line for…

The relevant scale is the number of hard constraints on the solution code, not the size of task as measured by "hours it would take the median programmer to write".

So eg., one line of code which needed to handle dozens of hard-constraints on the system (eg., using a specific class, method, with a specific device, specific memory management, etc.) will very rarely be output correctly by an LLM.

Likewise "blank-page, vibe coding" can be very fast if "make me X" has only functional/soft-constraints on the code itself.

"Gigawatt LLMs" have brute-forced there way to having a statistical system capable of usefully, if not universally, adhreading to one or two hard constraints. I'd imagine the dozen or so common in any existing application is well beyond a Terawatt range of training and inference cost.

Re: Watching AI drive Microsoft employees insane

#89

Well, the coding agent is pretty much a junior dev at the moment. The seniors are teaching it. Give it a 100k PRs with senior developer feedback and it'll improve just like you'd anticipate a junior would. There is no way that FANG aren't using the comments by the seniors as training data for their next version. It's a long-term play to have pricey senior developers argue with an llm

> using the comments by the seniors as training data for their next version

Yeah, I'm sure 100k comments with "Copilot, please look into this" and "The test cases are still failing" will massively improve these models.

Re: Watching AI drive Microsoft employees insane

#90
post #10

With how stochastic the process is it makes it basically unusable for any large scale task. What's the plan? To roll the dice until the answer pops up? That would be maybe viable if there was a way to automatically evaluate it 100% but with a human in the loop required it becomes untenable.

> What's the plan? Call me old school, but I find the workflow of "divide and conquer" to be as helpful when working with LLMs, as without them. Although what is needed to be considered a "large scale task" varies by LLMs and implementation. Some models/implementations (seemingly Copilot) struggles with even the smallest change, while others breeze through them. Lots of trial and error is needed to find that line for…

Its hard for me to think of a small, clearly defined coding problem an LLM cant solve.
Post reply on HN