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Don't force your kids to do math

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Re: Don't force your kids to do math

#81

Post by sublinear »

WalterBright wrote: post #63

> Without realizing it, he was doing algebra. A friend of mine taught remedial math at UW to incoming freshmen. She would write: x + 2 = 5 on the blackboard and ask a student "what is the value of x?" The student would see the x, and immediately respond with x means algebra, algebra is hard, I cannot do algebra. So she started writing: _ + 2 = 5 and ask the student to fill in the blank. "Oh, it's 3!"

The semantic meaning of a blank is much better understood to everyone than an arbitrary letter like 'x'.

People just want to know why it's x and not something else or how a letter can have value. They might even think how can 24 + 2 = 5? They just want something to grab onto and nobody is really teaching the concept of a symbol in a math class.

Re: Don't force your kids to do math

#82

Post by uwagar »

zmgsabst wrote: post #66
WalterBright wrote: post #63

> Without realizing it, he was doing algebra. A friend of mine taught remedial math at UW to incoming freshmen. She would write: x + 2 = 5 on the blackboard and ask a student "what is the value of x?" The student would see the x, and immediately respond with x means algebra, algebra is hard, I cannot do algebra. So she started writing: _ + 2 = 5 and ask the student to fill in the blank. "Oh, it's 3!"

I’ve always found that an indictment of math education — and spent many, many hours discussing it. When teaching addition, workbooks commonly use a box, eg, “[ ] + 2 = 5” — and first graders have no conceptual problem with this. Somehow, we lose people by the time we’re trying to formalize the same concept in algebra. There’s been many times I’ve written a box around letters in a problem and asked students “what’s in…

back when we was new in programming it was similarly difficult to grok

X = X + 1

once we got it, it was a like new world!

Re: Don't force your kids to do math

#83

Post by murkt »

j_bum wrote: post #74
eimrine wrote: post #70

Is there any knowledge that is recommended to be forced to kids?

Probably safety behaviors, e.g,, “let’s look both ways before we cross the street, regardless of whether you want to”

If you formulate the warnings just right, you wouldn’t need to “force” it, as kids will be willing to look both sides themselves. They like to be alive.

Re: Don't force your kids to do math

#84

Post by 5- »

uwagar wrote: post #82
zmgsabst wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve always found that an indictment of math education — and spent many, many hours discussing it. When teaching addition, workbooks commonly use a box, eg, “[ ] + 2 = 5” — and first graders have no conceptual problem with this. Somehow, we lose people by the time we’re trying to formalize the same concept in algebra. There’s been many times I’ve written a box around letters in a problem and asked students “what’s in…

back when we was new in programming it was similarly difficult to grok X = X + 1 once we got it, it was a like new world!

most likely this very unfortunate misnomer started with fortran, where it was deemed lucrative to point out "how much programs look like mathematic formulas!".

not only is this overloading a symbol (equality) with a completely different meaning (assignment), it is also a poor choice typographically, as it represents a directional operation with a directionless symbol.

using an arrow for assignment is much better.

it's also worth pointing out that unlike most others, logic programming languages (e.g. prolog) have actual variables, not references to mutable or immutable memory cells.

Re: Don't force your kids to do math

#85

Post by [deleted] »

WalterBright wrote: post #63

> Without realizing it, he was doing algebra. A friend of mine taught remedial math at UW to incoming freshmen. She would write: x + 2 = 5 on the blackboard and ask a student "what is the value of x?" The student would see the x, and immediately respond with x means algebra, algebra is hard, I cannot do algebra. So she started writing: _ + 2 = 5 and ask the student to fill in the blank. "Oh, it's 3!"

[deleted]

Re: Don't force your kids to do math

#86

Post by GodelNumbering »

sublinear wrote: post #81
WalterBright wrote: post #63

> Without realizing it, he was doing algebra. A friend of mine taught remedial math at UW to incoming freshmen. She would write: x + 2 = 5 on the blackboard and ask a student "what is the value of x?" The student would see the x, and immediately respond with x means algebra, algebra is hard, I cannot do algebra. So she started writing: _ + 2 = 5 and ask the student to fill in the blank. "Oh, it's 3!"

The semantic meaning of a blank is much better understood to everyone than an arbitrary letter like 'x'. People just want to know why it's x and not something else or how a letter can have value. They might even think how can 24 + 2 = 5? They just want something to grab onto and nobody is really teaching the concept of a symbol in a math class.

thank Descartes

Re: Don't force your kids to do math

#87

Post by lordfrito »

jodoherty wrote: post #65
add-sub-mul-div wrote: post #20

Something we don't pay enough attention to is that while calculators have solved everyday math to the point we downplay it as a required skill, people are not pulling out their calculator at the grocery store to make better purchase decisions, even though we all have one in our pocket now. So we handwave the importance of being able to do everyday math in our heads, while also not taking advantage of the tool that's…

I think most people don't care about optimizing an extra $10 out of their weekly grocery run. Probably a better example is figuring out the cost of a loan. Just multiply the amortized monthly payment by the term and compare that to the loan amount. If the difference makes you balk, then go ahead and walk. How many people even realize that loan interest is a significant cost and would bother to do that? Or know how to…

> I think most people don't care about optimizing an extra $10 out of their weekly grocery run

I remember when this kind of "optimization" was done regularly by a great many shoppers on budgets. Back in the day some stores even used to put calculators on the shopping carts.

People used to know how to budget. Apparently the average American is affluent enough to not need to be able to do this any more. I worry that the atrophy of these kinds of practical skills will cause much pain for a great many people at some point down the road.

Re: Don't force your kids to do math

#88

Post by ckolkey »

GodelNumbering wrote: post #86
sublinear wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The semantic meaning of a blank is much better understood to everyone than an arbitrary letter like 'x'. People just want to know why it's x and not something else or how a letter can have value. They might even think how can 24 + 2 = 5? They just want something to grab onto and nobody is really teaching the concept of a symbol in a math class.

thank Descartes

I thank, therefore I am...

Re: Don't force your kids to do math

#89

Post by jewelry »

And then your kids and their same generation would be replaced by their peer kids from hard working boys and girls from India and China. Unfortunately curiosity only works with brilliant minds. Normal minds plus curiosity is useless.
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